[quote]Your saying humans occur naturally[/quote] Yes [quote]Your argument is just basically "evolution exists"[/quote] No. I'm saying that we distinguish things that occur naturally with things that don't occur naturally. That is how we determine if something is designed. If you take away our ability to distinguish the two, then you cannot tell if anything is designed. The designed thing would be things that do not occur naturally. [quote]I'm saying humans couldn't possibly occur naturally when we are immensely complex, the human Mind alone we might never understand, yet an iPhone or any type of technology, would never be thought of as evolved from dirt... If you can explain where any matter came from to begin with[/quote] I take it you don't understand what naturally means and I take you don't understand evolution. I don't know where it came from. Can you explain it with evidence and not assertions?