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Edited by jRontgen: 4/16/2015 6:28:42 PM
60

1.1.2 Hurts snipers and further promotes shotgun/fusion use

1.1.2 has negatively impacted crucible

215

1.1.2 has helped crucible

532

I am indifferent

277

Bungie’s recent special ammo nerf has further damaged crucible balance; specifically it hurts sniper rifle users, which ironically further promotes shotgun/fusion use. The problem lies inherently on how the different weapon types use ammo. Shotguns and fusion rifles are much easier to aim and kill in 1-2 shots, meaning that kill to bullet ratio is very high. While snipers also kill in 1-2 shots, aiming is much more difficult, and thus a much larger portion of ammo is lost due to missed shots. The kill to bullet ratio is significantly lower. Since the special ammo nerf was so severe, people who choose to use snipers are pigeon holed into picking rifles that promote additional ammo. Essentially you are left with two options: use Icebreaker or try to find a sniper with field scout and surplus. The amount of special ammo picked up from a crate is equal to the capacity of one clip. For example, praedyth’s revenge with the field scout perk will pick up six rounds from a special ammo crate. Six rounds will net a very skilled sniper about two kills on average. Compared to a shotgun with (6 rounds), a skilled player can likely average around 4 kills. My summative point: the special ammo nerf disproportionately hurts sniper rifles, as compared to other special weapons. It did not appreciably reduce shotgun usage in the crucible, but rather increased it (as sniper rifles are now less viable). If you choose to use a sniper, your choices are dictated by ammo related perks (which reduces the variety and enjoyment of using that weapon class). I was fortunate enough to find a Longbow Synthesis with field scout and surplus, meaning 12 rounds per ammo crate. While this adaptation allows me to continue using sniper rifles efficiently in crucible, I am saddened that I can’t really use praedyth’s revenge or efrideet’s spear anymore. Thoughts on the crucible special ammo changes? ***UPDATE: A user messaged me wondering how surplus actually affects crucible special ammo, since there is some ambiguous information floating around. So, I decided to do a test of a few different rifles; in short, surplus is bullshit. The following are ammo pickups in crucible with three very different rifles, with and without armor that increases ammo carrying capacity: [u]Praedyth’s Revenge (base mag = 4)[/u] Field scout + armor = 6 Field scout – armor = 6 NO field scout + armor = 6 NO field scout – armor = 4 [u]Longbow Synthesis with SURPLUS (base mag = 5)[/u] Field scout + armor = 6 Field scout – armor = 6 NO field scout + armor = 4 NO field scout – armor = 3 [u]Efrideet’s Spear with SURPLUS (base mag = 3)[/u] …I didn’t have field scout on this rifle NO field scout + armor = 6 NO field scout – armor = 4

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  • It also eliminates people camping at the back of the map with snipers for the whole game so I think the patch did good

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  • I am very happy with the update. I mainly use snipers as my special. Yes, it has affected the amount of ammo u can get but I like how u don't see people spamming sniper bullets anymore. U have to take your time and actually aim. Much of it is being situationally aware and being tactically placed to use. But I feel there are less people using their special weapons as a crutch because u don't need gun skill to get kills with shotguns or fusion rifles. Primaries are primary for a reason

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  • I run out of sniper ammo instantly it seems and I've been seeing large increase in fusion rifle usage. But shotguns have not changed much. I get like 6-8 bullets from a crate and by the time i run around and one shot 5-8 people special ammo is already back again. So nothing has really changed there but snipers are ridiculous with ammo now and they are almost useless

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  • Actually it has toned down shotgun use significantly. People aren't running around with it as their primary anymore. I have only seen two fusion rifles in the last few days, and I haven't used any myself so I can't speak for them. Snipers i think were not hit as hard because they are used less than shotguns anyway. What the ammo changed for them is just that you have to miss less, and you can't be using it [b]all[/b] the time. It forces you to switch to primary in order to conserve ammo. I think that the update fixed the crucible, not ruined it.

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  • So, I agree with you that snipers were unfortunately hurt the worst with this update. Even though I don't snipe, I find this to be a bit of a bummer. However your conclusion that "therefore shotguns are MORE prevalent than ever" is simply untrue. Good snipers aren't putting their rifles away and swapping for a shotgun. Rather, all parties are using primaries more (and how is this a bad thing?) to fill the gap

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  • All maps favor close-mid range combat so nothing is going to balance snipers vs shotty/fusion.

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  • Can't spam body snipe shots anymore. Great update. Players will have to use secondarys in certain situations, which is as it was meant to be.

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  • 2
    I'm not a big crucible player or fan but I have played crucible since the update and found that I had more than enough secondary ammo. Never ran out once. A secondary weapon is exactly that, a secondary. Fair enough I use a shotgun but that is because I roll a scout as my primary and I need a close quarter weapon. I don't run around spamming the shotgun and only use it when the shit hits the fan and a player is on top of me. The update has made the crucible much better in my opinion and forces players to manage their ammo better and use the primary weapons more. I will prob start playing the crucible much more now.

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  • You make a good point, but I hate snipers anyway. Join the fight

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  • Only way to win is using the last word I hate the gun but I'm forced to use it to compete with others

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  • I've just decided to roll with either Icebreaker or Invective (depending on the map). I'll just make it a non-factor.

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  • 2
    If u learn were the amo spawns you can run with special amo just like before.... I get a full cap of special amo every match.

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  • I love sniping, but it wouldn't be fair to only nerf one type of special weapon ammo.

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  • Yeah it's really hurt snipers, you only get 4 bullets with each package meaning to have two kills with body shots and 4 kills with headshots, not good :/

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  • Edited by Nova Know: 4/17/2015 4:44:35 AM
    This update is dumb... stop making Destiny like halo only primaries bullshit, thats why you made special exotic slot so we use other than a dumb primary, Bungie just went full retard with this update, if i wanted to play primaries only i woulda buy halo -.-

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  • Edited by PH0E: 4/16/2015 11:43:06 PM
    I think it definitely hurt snipers however they were trying to hurt snipers. People were abusing the final round perk due to the abundance of ammo. Now the ammo is so small it hurts all snipers not just those that blew through ammo. I'm fine with having less spawns just allow snipers to start with a little more ammo.

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  • It mostly just allows thorn to be even more annoying in crucible

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  • while I miss running my Praedyths revenge nonstop run n gun, the update has allowed me to play smarter and choose my battles a bit better. I enjoy it honestly, it's more of a challenge now.

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  • I kinda think the ammo change went a *bit* too far, but it has definitely changed how I snipe. Take more time now to line up shots, and it doesn't help that I just generally suck with all special weapons. On another note, the Surplus perk doesn't increase how much ammo each pick up grants, it increases how many ammo pick ups drop from enemies. So...yeah...useless in PVP.

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  • The ammo change is simple. It makes it difficult for people to try to use their sniper rifle as a primary weapon the whole match...and it makes it harder for teams to run two or three snipers to lockdown the whole map and prevent any movement. Which used to be a big problem in Control matches on Shores of Time. Once a team got control of B and C.....two or three good snipers could make it *almost* impossible to even *approach* these control points. Never mind actually take them.

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  • Snipers have IB for ammo gg everybody go home

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  • Edited by Sixth Devil King: 4/19/2015 4:52:49 PM
    maybe want take lessons from this guy? (and about 500 more players who upload their sniper montages on youtube) if you cant use a sniper, then switch. its that simple. [spoiler]a very skilled player gets 2 kills out of 6 bullets... rly? or its just that YOU get 2 kills out of 6 shots? learn to aim... its not bungies fault if you need so many shots.[/spoiler]

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    1 Reply
    • why do you even miss your shots?

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    • If you miss that many snipes you shouldn't use one

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      3 Replies
      • 6 rounds will give a skilled sniper 2 kills? What's your definition of skilled? 6 rounds will give a skilled sniper 5-6 kills

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      • 2 kills per 6 shot clip? That says more about your ability than anything, bungie can't help you aim better

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