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originally posted in:Halo Archive
6/17/2015 10:08:52 PM
18
In Halo 4 chief says "I thought we had a truce with the Covenant"
However, in Halo 3, it was only the Elite Separatists that they were aligned with, not the covenant.
And even if there was a treaty between the entire covenant, Chief wasn't there to hear about it.
So my question is, was this line just an inconsistency/ oversight on 343's part?
English
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While in Halo 3 we only ever saw the Elites, the reality of the situation is that they had any Grunts, Jackals, Drones, Engineers, and Hunters that separated with them. This is why the Chief refers to them as "Covenant". Because they are Covenant.
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Not to question your abilities but can you provide a link to an official source or quote that states this? Because even in Halo 2 when the Grunts and Hunters teamed up with Arbiter, Chief STILL didn't see this. And in Halo 3 Chief still fought Grunts and Hunters ALONGSIDE Elites.
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Edited by Lord of Admirals: 6/18/2015 7:45:25 PMChief would have undoubtedly seen them as he moved about the Shadow of Intent. The lack of them in the game is an intentional oversight done by Bungie for gameplay purposes. Also, the notion that the Chief fighting against Hunters voids the possibility of those with their own opinions and beliefs is absurd.
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Still, I'm gonna need proof that they were actually sided with the Elites. Can't just state possibilities as facts.
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In Ghosts of Onyx (the section of the book that takes place post-Halo 2), Sangheili lead forces in combat against Jiralhanae and human forces were supplemented by Unggoy, Mgalekgolo, and Kig-Yar forces. Using common sense we could also determine this by the fact that the Covenant is an integrated military and society. Unggoy, Kig-Yar, Huragok, Mgalekgolo, and Yanme'e troops and personnel are going to remain under Sangheili control if they were there to begin with.
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"We are aboard, humans, and elites. Will you not come with us brother?" He didn't say Humans and Covenant. And the Post Halo 2 part of GoO was still in the earliest stages of the Great Schism. During that time, yes, Sangheili used Hunters and Grunts as Arbiter did in Halo 2. However, there is no proof that during Halo 3 it was anything more than Elites allied with humanity. And if there were more species, it had to be such a negligible amount that they didn't get mentioned in and "during halo 3 lore"
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[i]"There was honor in our Covenant once, and there shall be again!" -The Storm, Halo 3[/i] [quote]He didn't say Humans and Covenant. And the Post Halo 2 part of GoO was still in the earliest stages of the Great Schism. During that time, yes, Sangheili used Hunters and Grunts as Arbiter did in Halo 2.[/quote]You need to keep in mind the context of the situation for the player. It'd be rather confusing to hear that the Covenant is on board when we just defeated them. Those additional forces that sided with the Elites, they aren't just going to disappear, which is what you appear to be claiming. [quote]However, there is no proof that during Halo 3 it was anything more than Elites allied with humanity. And if there were more species, it had to be such a negligible amount that they didn't get mentioned in and "during halo 3 lore"[/quote]There's also nothing that outright says no Unggoy, Kig-Yar, Yanme'e, Lekgolo, or Huragok weren't present as well. I don't deny the majority of Separatist forces deployed on the Ark were Sangheili, but that doesn't void the fact the UNSC technically considered them a Covenant faction, and as the quote above shows, even Thel considered that as well.
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It was more bungie didn't want to confuse us in halo 3
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Of course, but that's not much of a story explanation.
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Forgot about that line. I suppose that is all the proof I need! Another question. Why were the Brutes in Halo 2 so un armored? During ODST (which was during Halo 2) they were armored the same as they are in Halo 3. So why were there two drastically different armaments for the Brutes that took place in the same time frame?
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Part of it obviously comes down to artistic licence and developer constraints. This may offer the explanation you're looking for though: [url=https://www.halowaypoint.com/en-us/universe/species/jiralhanae][i]"Upon integration into the original Covenant body, the Jiralhanae held a number of positions. Some of these jobs were simply an extension of their own native, clan-based organizational structure, though it became more formalized while under the banner of the Covenant. Roles included Chieftains, Captains, Stalkers, Majors, and Minors, all splintered into a number of varieties based on skein, functional and organizational placement, and the point it appeared during Covenant history."[/i][/url]
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Idk where I heard it but I thought that the unshaven in armored Brutes were specific to Tartarus' pack. Specially trained to be fearless without armor. But I don't know.
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Edited by Lord of Admirals: 6/19/2015 2:34:45 AMIt hasn't been confirmed, but what we do know about Jiralhanae skeins, strongly suggests the Brutes in Halo 2 are under Tartarus' clan. But that remains to be confirmed.
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Since Sir Lore of Admirals isn't here I will try my best to help you if he doesn't mind. My personal opinion is that 343 wanted us to battle a familiar enemy, along with the ability to add whatever they want to them. A forerunner race can have unlimited potential but the covenant is just a friendly face we are used to for the last 6 Halo games. It wouldn't really feel like Halo if we weren't fighting the alien races we know and love. So I think 343 wanted to still keep that Halo theme.
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I didn't say that the Covenant should have been removed from the game, in saying that Chiefs line in that particular scene was wrong. He should have said "I thought we had a truce with the Elites" not a truce with the Covenant. Chief was still fighting the covenant before the end of Halo 3. Also even now, there is no truce with the covenant. Only the Elites are even somewhat our allies. So why did Chief have an incorrect line?
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The covenant and humans agreed to a truce after the war ended but the covenant have broken that
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Again, how could Chief have known this? When the Forward Unto Dawn was sliced in half, the Elites were the only ones that Allied with humanity.
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He's asking how is it possible that chief would've known that
