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Edited by Hawpy: 7/13/2015 10:59:37 PM
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Hawpy

Why are Scout Rifles so rarely seen in Crucible?

Scout Rifles are currently the second-least used weapon type, ahead of only Sidearms that have been in that game for ~7 weeks, as opposed to just over 10 months. What I want to know is: why? They answer several problems and complaints that people seem to have at the moment Snipers OP - Scout Rifles are the only weapons that can actually compete with Snipers at long range reliably, so why are they not used? Thorn needs a range nerf - see above Auto Rifle buff - Some of the high RoF Scout Rifles can be rolled with Full Auto to provide a weapon that fires faster than a Focus Fire Auto Rifle of the SUROS Impact/RoF denomination, while also dealing more damage and having more range, so why not use them? Good examples are the Deadshot Luna and the NL Shadow. Makeshift AR right there. Thorn/TLW are broken with 2-shots - High impact Scout Rifles can score 3-hit kills that no one can complain about, hell, The Scholar can 2-shot. If you're looking for a counter, try MIDA Multi-Tool, the hidden talent of High-Calibre rounds and the speedy movements it allows for turn you into a someone that screams "You can't beat what you can't hit" If you were to ask me (here we go, yet another opinion), I think the reason behind their disuse is the abuse of Shotguns. I shan't lie, there is no worse weapon to be caught using than a Scout Rifle if a Shotgun comes round the corner, ready to blow your head off. I'd be very interested to know anyone else's reasons and thoughts on the matter. Perhaps, if nothing is going to be nerfed, a slight Scout Rifle buff is in order? The last one was in October and has shown no signs of increased usage Edit 1: It's great to have found a plethora of Scout Rifle users like myself, and I've thoroughly enjoyed reading and debating the points raised here. For now, I'm going to sleep, so will be unable to reply to any of you for the next few hours (rest assured, I shall do my best to get back to you ASAP). Thank you all very much for keeping this post as active as it has been! Edit 2: The answer I have been given many times now is "Why use them when Hand Cannons are available?". This is exactly the problem the Crucible faces at the moment. A Scout Rifle requires precision and nerve, but Exotic Hand Cannons can be put to stellar use by just about anyone, so there is no incentive to not use them - the bad players use them in hopes of raising their K/D by using something overpowered, and the good players use them so they don't fall behind to everyone else using the same weapons. Someone I used to be friends with, and now despise, has a K/D of 3.97 and 41942 kills with The Last Word, almost double the kills I have in Crucible full stop. From what I understand, he's ranked the 11th best player in the world (according to DestinyTracker). Combine those kind of stats with the sheer numbers of people using TLW/Thorn, it amazes me that this has gone on for so long. Edit 3: Seriously, massive thanks to everyone who has kept this in the "Trending" section for the last 15-16 hours, stoking the fire of debate with each new point raised. I owe you all one :D Edit 4: Out of curiosity, I'm wondering who has seen Datto's video that complains about the current state of Crucible ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BHenCd2BWNQ for those of you who are interested and yet to see it). It sums up pretty much every non-Scout Rifle related thing I could say, and unlike myself, he's a big enough personality in the community to cause a change

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  • I use Mida quite a bit and also use One/One Synthesis that has Full auto, heavy rounds and firefly.

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  • Edited by ZeroBlackHawk: 7/13/2015 4:51:51 PM
    I love my A.1F19 scout rifle, it has high caliber rounds that stagger enemies. Love using it on snipers, messes their shots up. It's on my Warlock. My go to gun in Trials.

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  • I'm a huge scout rifle user. I prefer Huge impact and low rate of fire scouts. My favorite is Aries Nemesis X4 and the Scholar.

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    • I love VoC on shores of time.

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    • Edited by Bizinator1: 7/13/2015 4:51:05 PM
      I'm a scout rifle user as well, and i agree with you. Using both the mida or a legendary scout rifle (like the one currently equipped on my hunter) makes a good combo with certain secondary weapons

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    • They just have too long in terms of time to kill. More recoil than they deserve often. I have tried and love scouts. I have the iron banner one which is as close as it gets to love for me. but still a little slow and I tried the dead shot which hits like an AR and kicks like it was a hand cannon WTF. They can be lived with and I often do but they fall short of many other weapon types. Use what you like though. If you enjoy it that is what matters.

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      Thats not it's hidden perk, it's hidden perk is the ability to stun enemies faster.

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      • I don't think Scout Rifles have ever been buffed... Scout Rifle's biggest issue is the CQC nature of most of the maps. They can do serious damage on some of the maps with longer sight lines, like Shores of Time. Personally, I can't make MIDA work for me, but I'm a big fan of The Scholar, depending on the map. VoC is also a really good scout for crucible.

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        • Because hand cannons have too much range, especially those of the exotic variety... I honestly love using scouts in the crucible, but what's the point of a long range weapon when the "close quarters" weapon class can have optimum performance at all ranges.

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        • I feel part of the reason is that they took away the big maps. I'm not sure about you, but I think that it should be a priority for us to get all the maps, big and small in the same playlist

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          • I switch between scout (mida, voc or deadshot luna) and handcannons (hawkawesome) It depends on the map and the style that works best for me that day. Bit I predict a pulserifle tsunami with a lot of "nerf the ToO pulserifle" posts in it's wake.

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          • Edited by Lime Man: 7/13/2015 4:27:08 PM
            Scholar (ADEPT) user here, and I'm not sure of it can two shot people, if you get a headshot without reactive reload you get around 75 damage headshot. With the reactive reload you do 98 per headshot exactly, so unless they got tickled by an auto rifle or something, I'm pretty sure it's still 3 shots, leaving them with the smallest amount of health after the second

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            • Cause that takes effort, a concept countless people aren't familiar with. Why use a scout rifle which you have to aim down the sights and pull the trigger a few times when you can use cheap and effortless tricks like Thorn's poison, Vex, Hawkmoon's lucky shots, Red Death's heal as you shoot. Welcome to the generation of hand me downs. Whenever I get killed by something else other than those mentioned, especially scout rifles, I salute them for their effort to earn their kill.

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              • Scouts for life

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              • Edited by P3rfectEnemy: 7/13/2015 4:30:50 PM
                Thats all i use unless I use thorn for a handcannon bounty. Just dont like thorn much.

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              • I usually run hawkmoon but I got gelions demise drop from iron banner since then I've been playing about with different scouts in crucible and it's so much more fun!! Possibly cause I always use scouts for pve. Anyway I'm off to level up my 2nd mida

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              • #MIDAmasterrace

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                Why would someone use a scout rifle when hand cannons are just as good. Datto made a great video explaining why the two most broken weapons in the game out perform the guns designed for those types of engagements in pvp. However, imo scout rifles will never be replaced in pve, they are my go to weapon for every situation.

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              • Pulse rifles is the reason why you don't see scouts. pulse rifle range is nearly as good as scouts. Pulse rifle TTK is way better than scout. pulse rifles are more versatile across long and short range. In almost every way right now, pulse rifles are better than scout rifles.

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              • Salvation State for life

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                I love using scouts. I rock MIDA all the time in crucible, wish the vesta 347 was actually in the game... I use gheleons a lot as well, and that thing is a tank with hidden hand and hand laid stock.

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              • Because pulse rifles like "The Messenger" are better.

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              • There are probably a ton of reasons. Everyone can equip a sniper as a secondary so less need to use a scout rifle. Scout rifles are difficult to use in CQC. At distance, players are probably going to hide once they get hit a few times. Mid-range is the optimal range in multiplayer so handcannons and pulse rifles win.

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              • Hand cannons are much more powerful

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              • Gheleons Demise wrecks everyone.

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              • Because thorn, tow and shotguns are just better

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