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8/4/2015 6:57:37 PM
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Wow do people seriously not understand how expansion games work? A lot of people seem to compare this game to mmos so ill do it here.
When you release an expansion for an mmo things tend to happen:
-level cap increases
-new gear/weapons become available that have better stats than the ones before making old ones irrelevant.
-new content; places to explore, raids, dungeons (strikes on this case), new weapons/armor that are unique to the expansion
-added game types and maps for pvp playlists
When World of Warcraft gets a new expansion you don't see the forums blowing up saying "omg the last year or so was a waste of time because I can use my current stuff?!". They actually embrace the new things because if you enjoy the game you want it to be fun and new again which is the point of an expansion.
The differences between actual mmos and Destiny is that most of then have a "transmogrification" system that allows you to use the visuals of a piece of gear on your character without sacrificing the stats of the gear you are wearing or want to wear. There storage systems are more vast allowing you to store more items so in case you want to transmog something you'll have enough space to store a piece of gear or weapon that is 10 levels below you.
So if you're complaining about your "grind" being a waste of time is this; it was. In the end you are the making the game fun. If all you do is play and grind while not enjoying it whats the point of even playing? Yeah it's gonna suck not being able to use your old weapons and armor in PvE but there will be plenty of new and cools ones to get. They haven't mentioned changing crucible so at the moment you'll be able to use your old gear in crucible without being at a disadvantage. Who knows, maybe they will have a system that will be like "transmogging".
I have enjoyed all the time I've spent playing destiny and can't wait for all these new changes. Get over the fact that you can't upgrade old stuff and thank them for actually making old stuff useful in the past 2 dlc's because mmos never do that.
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I think you misunderstand the mismanagement that bungie has imposed on destiny. There are several problems and lets be honest at this point bungie doesn't know what it's doing. In mmos new gear comes out and the level cap raises; that's fine. Let's look at destiny. First expansion old legendaries obsolete, exotics upgradeable, Second expansion everything upgradeable Third expansion legendaries obsolete, exotics?, leveling system changed? It doesn't seem like they have a ten year plan. It seems like they're just making this up as they go along. In mmos you get new levels and gear but your character remains he same so it doesn't feel like a reboot every expansion. Destiny is a game where you're tied to the good loot you have. That's why rebooting loot hits closer to home.
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Your first mistake is thinking that TDB and HoW are expansions. The level cap rises 2 levels, 1 raid we can solo, 2-3 exotics per class and raid weapons/gear (again can get solo) doesn't really count as an expansion. The other gives us two 3 man activities; PoE for pve and ToO for pvp. Again 2 light levels and that content is hardly expansion material, just dlc. How are we being rebooted? And how do you not feel rebooted in mmo expansions? All the gear and items acquired that affect gameplay is useless, basically restarting at the new level cap, seems rebooted to me. Just because light level doesn't affect level doesn't mean we are being rebooted. What's the point in them trying to make new weapons and armor if no one uses them? I understand that the HoW raid armor/weapons (PoE) are garbage in stats and visuals but doesn't mean they shouldn't keep trying. Plenty of devs have released god awful graphics and stats on weapons that are worse than anything in PoE.
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Not expansions? I should send you a pic of the booklet that comes with destiny and the expansion pass I purchased. I agree the content is paltry that doesn't mean they didn't advertise it as such. This isn't an mmo so mmo terminology might be lost however how and TDB are expansions according to bungie and activision. The difference between this and just getting new gear as I've explained already is that in mmos they don't take away the levels you've earned or completely overhaul the leveling system. Also this game is more weapon focused. Like I said people identify more with the weapons than the guardians. I think the way they handled upgrading in how was correct. You can upgrade if you wanted but you weren't forced to. I don't see what's wrong with that.
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People need to get over the "omg I want to play how and with what I want" bullshit. So you have a gun from the first raid, doesn't mean that you should be able to use it in the next expansion but sooo many people cried like they are now that they put in a flawed upgrade system. You're acting like acquiring etheric light is this huge feat. It's so easily obtained that it's not even fun or fun, unless it's ToO because I enjoy that game mode. They most likely aren't adding anything like that and if they do reveal they aren't having a more competitive pvp playlist you won't see me on here raging over something so petty. I don't see how removing light from gear is such a big deal, you still have the gear ffs. I can almost bet that when Cosmo said dint delete your old stuff, sounds like they are going to have some sort of cosmetic thing to maybe change appearances (I really hope they do). That aside you have still always been level 20 even with light gear. It's a stat that made this game'a end game such garbage. At least in og destiny if you were 30 that actually meant you had to run VoG on hard unless you just used an exotic helmet. There needs to be a barrier between the difficulty of raids. There needs to be normal version weapons/gear then hard mode (heroic) weapons/gear. There's no point in doing the raids on hard except for the very few things you can't get on normal. What I mean is that a normal helmet has stats of 80 intellect and 75 discipline. Hard mode needs to have 110 intellect and 105 discipline. Or something along those lines as long as it's better. Same with weapons from vendors and normal had an attack of 400 while hard mode has 435.
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You're really going off on a tangent there and it might just be me but I didn't see what your point was. First you complain because people are complaining about bungies decision, then you complain about how the old system was better. Removing light levels removes all the 14 levels of progress you made after 20, which was an essential part and the heart of this game.
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I'm not complaining about anything. I'm merely pointing out that what they are doing is a good thing. Not everything can be relevent or viable all the time through a game like this. How does "Light level is a stat that made this game's end game such garbage" sound like I thought the old system is better? People just need to stop complaining and enjoy the first year of this game and if they are that made over all their current gear being obsolete come TTK then good riddance. Why would I want to have a community full of these people who have no idea how a game is suppose to progress over a course of 10 years? There will always be change and some changes will be larger that others. Some games even go as far as redoing their entire talent system, something that has been with their game for 6+ years and we have people complaining because bungie has seen that players don't like having to acquire gear from raids to get to max level? It was a [b]TERRIBLE[/b] level cap system. I for one (and am not the only one) who is happy with this change.
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Edited by kai767: 8/4/2015 7:25:25 PMPeople like you really make me angry. You are entitled to your opinion but DO NOT tell me how mmo work. i have an absolute outstanding weapon collection, in which i put so much effort and time. i wanted to grow stronger and stronger. They only reason bungie does not allow us to further upgrade our gear is because they are too lazy and not creative enough to come up with weapons that are good enough to be used next or instead of the old ones. take a look at the prison of elders weapons!!! no freakin wonder that no one uses them!!! if people want to use new weapons - go right ahead. but i want to have A CHOICE you know? why the -blam!- would i spend weeks getting the best possible gear only to hear that all that was in vain. This really pisses me off. its a -blam!-ing joke. Tell me: Why would i ever upgrade and collect again? And please dont answer: because thats how mmos work. DO NOT compare destiny with WOW. these games are totally different!! and please dont answer either: because its fun. i will throw up!!! i won't allow people to tell me how to have fun with the game. I HAVE FUN COLLECTING AND UPGRADING gear! Imagine that.
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Wow lol. If you're getting this upset over a video game please reevaluate some real life things. Please learn to read my god... First of all I'm simply doing this comparison because there are A LOT of people (excluding myself) who think Destiny is a MMO. While I tend to disagree Destiny does have quite a few mmo features. Always online play, social tower where players intersect with each other, daily quests in the form of bounties, having a level cap, upgrading gear, raids, dungeons (strikes), pvp playlists and more. The only real things that [b]DO NOT[/b] make Destiny an MMO is lack of actually questing, no trade system or auction house and the amount of players in an instance at a time; example - the tower only holds up to 16 players per tower instance. If you increase that too say 100 then it's getting closer. However current mmos can hold up to thousands of players in 1 instance all at the same time. You also didn't read very well when I said "you playing the game makes it fun for you and if you don't enjoy what your playing whats the point", never did I say anything about trying to tell you how to play the game or tell you how to have fun. In fact I'm saying quite the opposite, that you need to do things in destiny that are fun to [b]YOU[/b] in order to keep enjoying the game. You like to collect armor and weapons? Great then by all means run the raids, strikes, do pvp, whatever it is as long as you have fun. Hey guess what? There is more shit to collect in TTK if you didn't realize. Also collectors tend to store thief collected items not play with them. I have a bunch of shit I collected over the year I've been playing and I had fun collecting it. Now there will be other things to collect, no one is forcing you to delete all your currently collected stuff. Keep them for crucible, unless you suck at crucible then delete them I guess. Why are you so mad? Seriously? It's quite sad tbh.
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Edited by kai767: 8/4/2015 9:02:00 PMWell this is my first online computer game. usually i dont spend this much time on any game but i thought : since you are generally a very thorough and structured person why not amass and collect the best possible arsenal one could have? And trust me i did just that. it also gave me a great deal of satisfaction there is no denying that. When i learned today that my arsenal will eventually become obsolete it just hit me and i felt and still feel like the time i spent was for nothing. it really doesnt matter if this scenario had to be expected. i didn't expect it. the text i wrote was indeed out of anger and i already calmed down. i didn't mean to insult you or anything. if i did i apologize. still my appproach to the game will be different from now on since i now know that upgrading and leveling gear is not worth it. it just isn't. But i suppose thats my problem. to be honest i am a little jealous of you that the changes don't seem to affect you at all. Thats a good thing. and i have to agree that its definately not worth it to get mad over a computer game. i am mad at myself that i didn't anticipate the upcoming changes. i could have saved myself a lot of time trust me...Take care
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To paraphrase you, people like you make me frustrated. You say you have a good collection and you enjoy collecting and upgrading? What I want to know is this, what do you know about the new guns/gear? The answer is nothing. What if there is a gun called fatehammer that has the best elements of fatebringer and black hammer? Suddenly your old collection would seem pointless. These new weapons can be collected and upgraded, (which you enjoy.) No-one says you have to get rid of your current collection. What if you COULD still use your year one gear? Then what's the point in having year 2 gear? There isn't any! Where the fun in having all the best stuff all ready? Other people would complain about the lack of content coming out. These games are all about the grind for loot. Games fail without new loot. Another question, what do you play most now, PvP or pve?
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I'd argue that a large amount of my collection is pointless. I'd also argue that large collections of.....well, just about anything - are pointless. I have stuff like a Stalker BNGL simply because its cool looking to me. I'm leaving Thorn because its boring to use in every game. I rarely use Icebreaker unless I'm weirdly out of ammo synths. I'll still take 'em out plinking - unless the new stuff turns them into ornaments. One thing I liked from games like Skyrim was that I'd collect a ton of stuff I loved that was meaningful to me, and even though I didn't use them I had a place to show them off. That would be nice.
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Completely agree with your sentiment. Maybe a separate storarge section to keep your favourites. Same as a real world gun collector would. They are still killing machines and have history and stories attached to them. BUT, I woulnt want to go up against an ak47 with a musket! That's all it boils down to, nobody's being forced to dismantle everything, its just that there's better coming along and people are scared of change.
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True; but its not an unfounded fear. With Dark Below, the old stuff wasn't upgradeable. With HoW, it suddenly was - my prediction at the time (fwiw) was that the ascension was a bit of a placeholder to make up for what did end up being a generally lackluster addition to the armory.
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It sounds like you've heard every rational argument and fought it with irrationality. Take a break from the game sir or madam, it's not healthy to subject yourself to pointless rage.
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^^^not this
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This^^^^
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I'm not disagreeing, just remember that Destiny isn't an MMO. That said, I laugh at all the people complaining about their *insert exotic* being nerfed in the upcoming Weapons Update 2.0. When The Taken King releases guns like Gjallarhorn, Thorn, and Icebreaker will be completely irrelevant.
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Exotics won't be completely irrelevant, we'll be keeping those.
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I know it's not. When I said "most people tend to compare destiny to mmos" I meant just that. Never said I think it is.
