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originally posted in: Sunbreaker is Too Strong w/proof
10/10/2015 10:16:05 AM
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I went through the trouble of comparing Sunbreaker and Sunsinger side-by-side in a post the other day. And while I don't expect them to be equivalent in every single aspect, I do expect them to have significant trade-offs over each other. Please point out what flaws I've made in this argument (Please note I'm ignoring useless perks - Fleet Fire and Angel of Light). TL;DR: Sunbreaker has much stronger perks than most people realize, and many people seem to be unaware of this fact. When comparing Sunbreaker perks with equivalent perks from other classes, Sunbreaker not only has stronger perks, but also has the single best PvP perk in Cauterize. My conclusion is that replacing Cauterize with a different perk would not only balance HoS's power spike and open up counterplay, but also enable different build paths for Sunbreakers and build paths that could possibly be less super-reliant. Let's start with grenades because this is one of the parts where you're vastly downplaying Sunbreaker. Both classes have Fusion. Thermite and Solar play similar roles - zone control - Thermite is better at controlling choke points, lasts longer, and covers more ground while solar is better at covering important objectives and can Ignite (So the two are near-equivalent). Firebolt and Incendiary are in similar roles - both are weak but have limited use as around-the-corner finishers and/or poke. They do about the same damage, have about the same range, and (can) both ignite. Firebolt is harder to dodge while Incendiary can hit more people. Grenade summary: They're about the same. Melee: It's clear that from a mechanics-standpoint, Scorch is better. However, people are vastly underplaying some of Sunbreaker's melee perks. Scorch is more defensive whereas Sunstrike is more offensive - Brimstone and Thermal Vent fill similar roles with TV being stronger. Melting Point and Flame Shield are exact opposites with which is better being a playstyle choice. Stoke the Forge is massively better than Solar Wind after its nerf and is actually a better version of Knife Juggler due to the base CD reduction. Melee summary: Scorch is clearly superior at face value, but has weaker perks. Super: Let's be clear. There's no question about which super is superior. I won't waste time and space explaining it, I'll just summarize. Hammer of Sol has more kill potential with less skill required (Fusion Grenade stickying versus hammer throwing with possible tracking) to kill, gets damage reduction for free (Radiance requires a perk), and has slightly longer duration (Forgemaster v Radiant Will). Other perks (The part where Sunbreaker is supposedly weak): Ignoring the standard "Stat" perks, Sunsinger has four viable perks - Longer Radiance, grenades ignite, ignite lasts longer, and two grenades. Of these, I'd say Radiant Will is a necessity so longer ignite is gone. Between Grenades ignite and two grenades the two are near equal - if you use grenades on CD having two charges of grenade rarely matters and ignite isn't so strong as to be make-or-break. Not to say they aren't decent choices, but let's take a look at Sunbreaker shall we? Sunbreaker has four-ish (Depending on arguing whether Simmering Flames is worth losing Cauterize or Fire keeper) viable perks - Hammers track, hammers chain explosions on kill, ABILITIES (NOT just super) heal, or sunspots give an overshield and increase HoS length. Of these, Hammers Track/Chain is about the same value as Radiant Will. The problem comes when you compare Cauterize to ANY other perk in the game from a PvP standpoint. Cauterize makes Sunbreaker broken - not only do your 1-shot hammers regen health, but your Fusion/Thermite grenade and resettable-on-kill melee do as well! Fire Keeper isn't nearly as strong as it requires losing Forgemaster for the Sunspot hammer perk or reset-on-kill for the sunspot melee perk but the sheer power behind Cauterize makes every single one of Sunsinger's perks look weak in comparison and even makes the other two Sunbreaker final perks look weak despite being fairly strong from an objective standpoint. In conclusion, the ONLY thing that Sunsinger bests Sunbreaker in is its melee and it's not anywhere near strong enough to make up for the massive amount of power Sunbreaker has in Cauterize and its super. So either Sunsinger is underpowered (IMO, it's not - I know Sunsinger can do well) or Sunbreaker is overpowered. And let's be clear - if it were true and Sunbreaker's "general perks" were weaker than Sunsinger's, the two would be fairly well-balanced against each other. It's okay for Sunbreaker to have such a strong super if it has to give up power when HoS is down. The simple fact of the matter, though is that it doesn't. And the main reason for that? Cauterize has too much power IMO. Honestly, replacing Cauterize's current perk with something else altogether seems like a great option at this point. Not only does it balance HoS's massive power spike, but it could also open up opportunities for Sunbreakers to be more powerful outside of their super depending on what the perk could be changed to. Sorry for the wall, but it's getting frustrating to see Sunbreakers continually say that outside of their super Sunbreaker sucks. It's simply not true.
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