HoS gets 55% reduction, not 50%. You can look up the videos for proof if you want. A HoS with only max armor can survive GG. A BladeDancer with only max armor cannot. Same goes for a 1000YS impact sniper headshot. I'm not sure if a bladedancer with max armor and "arc subclass gets more armor" can survive it or not, haven't tried, but that's not the point. HoS gets more damage reduction for (seemingly) no reason.

Hunters get more agility and blink for "seemingly no reason". Warlocks get more recovery and blink for "seemingly no reason". See how dumb that sounds?

Alright guess I'll type out exactly what I mean since it seems you couldn't catch my drift. When I said "HoS gets more damage reduction for (seemingly) no reason." I was comparing HoS and BladeDance. Hos is ranged, has an aoe, homes in slightly, and lasts longer than blade dancer. When you consider all of that, I see no reason why it should also have higher damage reduction. I have a feeling you'll argue that blade dancer has blink and higher agility, while that's true, even with lower agility titans can move faster than a blade dancer by skating. Not having blink is made up for with having a ranged super. So if you cancel those out, you're left with the fact that titans get and aoe that homes in and lasts longer than blade dancer. I see no reason why they should also get more damage reduction. Please quit trying to call me dumb, I'm more than happy to have an intelligent conversation about this.

Didn't call you dumb, said the statement sounded dumb. BD can last far longer than HoS with the right setup and play style. I'm personally impartial to nerf or buff, but I don't think an intelligent convo can be had with the limited server stat data we have, and the increasingly "alarmist" mentality of the boards.

[quote] BD can last far longer than HoS with the right setup and play style. I[/quote] Gotta disagree in a realistic pvp setting. Even with mask of the thrid man and encore (which makes you lose heath regen) you're gonna run out pretty quick. Time is the most limiting factor on blade dance. If you compare the default time for both blade dance and Hos (with forge master, the most common perk) I'm pretty sure HoS has twice the duration. You'd need to kill a lot of people without using any unnecessary swings to make up that time.

Unfair comparison. You're directly stating you'd do the comparison for 1 class with a perk that alters the time against another class without a perk that could adjust the time. Your view of a "realistic pvp setting" is likely different than mine. A well timed BD can be as effective as a well timed SB (or stormcaller for that matter). The only reality that matters is the server statistics. If they show sunbreakers are outclassing all others by a strong margin, then you could argue it's overpowered.

I haven't testing it, but I believe with no perks at all, HoS has a longer duration than bladedance. Please correct me if I'm wrong. The amount of time you can add on with encore and mask of the third man (from my experience) will not equal the amount of extra time you get from forgemaster. In a realistic pvp setting I'm thinking you'll get 3 kills per super (for both). With HoS and forge master, you'll be able to pace that out over a longer time than with encore and mask of the third man. That doesn't even account for the fact that doing so will make you lose your health regen perk and use up your exotic slot for a blade dancer. I'm still seeing clear advantage -> sunbreaker. [quote]The only reality that matters is the server statistics. If they show sunbreakers are outclassing all others by a strong margin, then you could argue it's overpowered.[/quote] I agree, but from my own experience I feel like sever data is going to back me up on a lot of my arguments. I know I personally average more kills per super with HoS than anything else.

So far, the public data we have (Destiny Tracker) is not showing SB as being the strongest. Technically, Nightstalker is...but that could be skewed by the glitches. Stormcaller is performing stronger than Sunbreaker, and nobody seems to have an issue with that. My personal feeling is the manner in which people are dying to sunbreaker is what's most annoying and likely the reason for the vitriol. We shall see. I disagree with your analysis of SB>BD overall though. I think it comes down to the player. Lest we forget a skilled bladedancer will go invis removing themselves from the map - and they have great skills to add to their non-super game whereas a sunbreaker is nearly 100% super-based in regards to perks. Truthfully, i still prefer striker to SB, but I hate when people use personal experience to determine anything balance related in competitive gaming atmospheres.

Destiny Tracker doesn't have a stat for "kills per super activation" which would be the most illuminating stat in regards to how "OP" HoS is. I disagree with the neutral game assessment. I've always found invis 100% worthless against skilled players. The only things they have are blink which is not nearly as effective as it used to be, and quickdraw (or whatever it's called). About the only viable grenade they have any more is the sticky due to the arc bolt nerf. The range on blink strike is really nice though, and you can either have it always up or abuse how broken backstab is for a 1 hit from nearly any direction. Sunbreakers have incendiary grenades which are amazing if you're good with them, and a sticky to choose if you're not. The burn on the melee is really nice and lasts a long time and with stoke the forge it's always up. Cauterize also triggers on grenade and melee kills which is awesome. Blade dancer probably has a little better neutral game overall, but not by much. Sunbreakers have a lot stronger neutral game than most give them credit for, the only thing they lack is melee range. my personal favorite for pvp is defender, but I'm definitely running sunbreaker for anything competitive.

I again disagree on the invis portion. It isn't about "sight" it's about removing yourself from the radar to create a surprise flank situation. I'm not trying to be snarky, i'm honestly asking as I feel it changes the perception of overall gameplay. Do you play with a dedicated team? Your statements seem to be that of someone that does not. I think a lot of people that don't play with dedicated teams view the game very differently than those of us that do. When my team hears the clang of a hammer activation, we call out where the HoS is. (same with BD or SC). Having that understanding we quickly determine if we have a super to counter, or a current heavy to use on them. If not, we hold back and waste the enemies super charge, in effect giving him zero kills. When our titan activates his HoS we see the enemy continue to funnel at us like morons as the titan gleefully decimates the team, likely to later appear here on the boards to denounce the "OP garbage" that is sunbreaker. The difference between HoS & Stormcaller? Stormcaller is harder to dodge lol. The melee range is what kills it. What good is a burn melee if you still have to hit with it? Shotguns > melee for titans most days. Blink strike gives extra damage, range, and is very fast. Hands down, blade dancer has the better melee, and obviously warlocks range alone makes them the undisputed melee god.