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11/4/2015 6:46:38 AM
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"Cosmic energy" Unless that has strict defining characteristics I'm pretty sure it can be classed as ki, the energy of the DBZ universe, in which case Goku would wreck shop.
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Yes, it has strict defining characteristics... Ki is the basic energy that anyone has. Just beings who are not earthborn tend to have higher amounts of ki in their body.
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What particular characteristic of cosmic energy makes Goku susceptible to lose to Silver Surfer?
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Arrangement of matter, time travel, element transmutation, suppressing powers, manipulation absorption and discharge of energy and radiation.
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Those aren't characteristics of cosmic energy. You just listed a bunch of random abstract concepts.
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No, those are the abilities that are able to be used if one attains cosmic energy... Those said abilities are (present) during the use of cosmic energy. That defines a characteristic. Please don't tell me you're believing Ki or Comic energy is real...
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I'm not sure where you're extracting that I've invested actual belief in these but don't worry about that. Those abilities are not beyond the DBZ universe. Using ki the Kais can create matter by arranging molecular structures. Instant transmission, one of Goku's abilities, is conceptually impossible without time travel, plus time has been reversed in DBZ. It's nothing too elaborate.
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Transmission has nothing to do with time travel. The user's body is simply moving to another place just at a fast speed. That's like saying someone who uses a burst of speed is time travelling. You got the manipulation of matter part, except that wasn't our main subject. You could essentially interpret that any non universal concept from another series could be present if you want to "connect loose chains".
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It's not a speed burst. It's literally instantaneous. As I said, conceptually impossible without time travel. Also time can be reversed in the DBZ universe. If you're speculating about a crossover battle then you need to make connections like this. That's the only way to reconcile the differences.
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If so then couldn't Goku actually "time traveled" to stop Frieza from blowing up the planet? Or couldn't he actually "time traveled" to stop Frieza from destroying planet Vegeta? What about the time when Earth got blown up by Majin (Kid) buu? As you said, making loose connections is necessary when speculating a crossover battle. Too much Screwattack battles huh?
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I never said Goku could time travel. I said time travel is a concept not foreign to the DBZ universe and not impossible via Ki. Goku has a certain degree of time control, but he can only manifest it in his ability to instantly appear in another location at will. I don't know why you're bringing up Screw Attack. They have absurdly biased "analysis" and "calculation".
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You clearly said that instant transmission was time travel thus making the point that Goku was capable of time traveling. Indeed, the concept is not foreign to the DBZ universe. But we only know of one biological time traveller. Whis.
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Future trunks? Although he did use a ship.
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Biological....
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Don't forget the silver surfer only has a fraction of the power cosmic, his abilities aren't limitless and are gone with the removal of his board, within the marvel universe he's mid tier at best the power an ssj God controls is similar to the living tribunal from first glance although we have yet to see the full extent of it. As far as time travel you're right in that organics can't truly do it as of what we've seen.
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Finally someone with knowledge! Yes, the silver Surfer only has a fraction of cosmic energy but it has been said that he has the most cosmic energy out of all of Galactus's heralds... Since we're going with super sayian god form, then I guess we can include Silver Surfer with all the fractals... More than mid tier.
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Still only mid tier once you include the celestials, the beyonder, living tribunal, franklyn Richards, dark Phoenix, lucifer, Michael, thanos especially with the infinity gauntlet, him (Adam Warlock) the list goes on and deadpool is op can destroy anyone within the Marvel universe by cheating. Big comic book fan sadly DC and Marvel been reading them for nigh on 30 years.
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Our issue was never with the ranking of him in the marvel or DC universes... We are talking about Goku and Silver Surfer. Deadpool only won because no one was thinking with their head.. Or, they over thought the situation.
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Or he breaks the fourth wall skips ahead to see what happens then goes back to before the encounter and ends it before it begins, he has done that before, what I was trying to say was silver surfer is below their power now probably similar to ssj 3 Goku at the end of the buu saga they have eclipsed that by a long way now.
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Unless a new advancement is given to Silver Surfer as how Venom got a upgrade... But that's probably not going to happen any time soon. Yeah the 4th wall... The easiest way to win or lose.
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He actually did wipe out the entire marvel universe at one point, can't wait for the film it actually looks good. I really can't see silver surfer getting a buff sadly especially now galactus has been rendered to bitch level in that universe, the big killer for me was odinforce goes well above the power cosmic
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Until the next big crunch occurs...
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Maybe, just not convinced they'll do it.
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Edited by a blue gecko: 11/4/2015 8:20:19 AMI did not equate time travel to instant transmission. I said conceptually, if a universe has instant transmission the way it works in DBZ the universe can reconcile time travel. Whis clearly has much more control over time than Goku. I'll admit he may not even use Ki for that though. There might exist another force in the DBZ universe, yet unknown.
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Now that our time travel argument is done... I had listed many characteristics about cosmic energy. Which all triumphs over all forms of Goku.
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Oh goodness no they don't. Half of what you listed can be filed under 'matter manipulation'. Do tell me how one of the capabilities you listed can be used to effectually defeat Goku.
