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11/4/2015 7:24:14 AM
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It's not a speed burst. It's literally instantaneous. As I said, conceptually impossible without time travel. Also time can be reversed in the DBZ universe. If you're speculating about a crossover battle then you need to make connections like this. That's the only way to reconcile the differences.
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If so then couldn't Goku actually "time traveled" to stop Frieza from blowing up the planet? Or couldn't he actually "time traveled" to stop Frieza from destroying planet Vegeta? What about the time when Earth got blown up by Majin (Kid) buu? As you said, making loose connections is necessary when speculating a crossover battle. Too much Screwattack battles huh?
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I never said Goku could time travel. I said time travel is a concept not foreign to the DBZ universe and not impossible via Ki. Goku has a certain degree of time control, but he can only manifest it in his ability to instantly appear in another location at will. I don't know why you're bringing up Screw Attack. They have absurdly biased "analysis" and "calculation".
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You clearly said that instant transmission was time travel thus making the point that Goku was capable of time traveling. Indeed, the concept is not foreign to the DBZ universe. But we only know of one biological time traveller. Whis.
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Future trunks? Although he did use a ship.
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Biological....
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Don't forget the silver surfer only has a fraction of the power cosmic, his abilities aren't limitless and are gone with the removal of his board, within the marvel universe he's mid tier at best the power an ssj God controls is similar to the living tribunal from first glance although we have yet to see the full extent of it. As far as time travel you're right in that organics can't truly do it as of what we've seen.
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Finally someone with knowledge! Yes, the silver Surfer only has a fraction of cosmic energy but it has been said that he has the most cosmic energy out of all of Galactus's heralds... Since we're going with super sayian god form, then I guess we can include Silver Surfer with all the fractals... More than mid tier.
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Still only mid tier once you include the celestials, the beyonder, living tribunal, franklyn Richards, dark Phoenix, lucifer, Michael, thanos especially with the infinity gauntlet, him (Adam Warlock) the list goes on and deadpool is op can destroy anyone within the Marvel universe by cheating. Big comic book fan sadly DC and Marvel been reading them for nigh on 30 years.
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Our issue was never with the ranking of him in the marvel or DC universes... We are talking about Goku and Silver Surfer. Deadpool only won because no one was thinking with their head.. Or, they over thought the situation.
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Or he breaks the fourth wall skips ahead to see what happens then goes back to before the encounter and ends it before it begins, he has done that before, what I was trying to say was silver surfer is below their power now probably similar to ssj 3 Goku at the end of the buu saga they have eclipsed that by a long way now.
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Unless a new advancement is given to Silver Surfer as how Venom got a upgrade... But that's probably not going to happen any time soon. Yeah the 4th wall... The easiest way to win or lose.
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He actually did wipe out the entire marvel universe at one point, can't wait for the film it actually looks good. I really can't see silver surfer getting a buff sadly especially now galactus has been rendered to bitch level in that universe, the big killer for me was odinforce goes well above the power cosmic
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Until the next big crunch occurs...
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Maybe, just not convinced they'll do it.
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Edited by a blue gecko: 11/4/2015 8:20:19 AMI did not equate time travel to instant transmission. I said conceptually, if a universe has instant transmission the way it works in DBZ the universe can reconcile time travel. Whis clearly has much more control over time than Goku. I'll admit he may not even use Ki for that though. There might exist another force in the DBZ universe, yet unknown.
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Now that our time travel argument is done... I had listed many characteristics about cosmic energy. Which all triumphs over all forms of Goku.
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Oh goodness no they don't. Half of what you listed can be filed under 'matter manipulation'. Do tell me how one of the capabilities you listed can be used to effectually defeat Goku.
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Arrangement of matter... One hit and Goku is turned into a chimp. Time travel... Can destroy the pod Goku was sleeping in on his way to Earth.(Cooler would be satisfied) Transmutation of elements... Oh look out Goku a regular bolder is heading your way. But wait it's made out of titanium!?
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The Silver Surfer can't manipulate matter just like that, especially not organic matter. Sorry but you can't just bend the abilities of your hero because you so loosely defined the source of his power. He especially can't time travel, let alone decades into the past. He also wouldn't have the foresight to do so before encountering Goku. Elemental transfusion is the same thing as matter manipulation, but it's not like tossing a boulder (of [b]any[/b] material) would present Goku with a problem LOL.
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Mmm, good call on that Boulder throwing thing lmao. He could just flick it away... Instantaneous is simply fast speeds though, has been explained in the anime before briefly. Also, the Surfer CAN be separated from his board, which in turn would render him powerless. Understand however, that Goku would lose simply because he would never allow that to happen. He likes to fight strong opponents lol. Never takes advantage like that.
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So you believe... You say that I am loosely defining cosmic energy even though you counter my example with a implementation of knowing cosmic energy. Basically, you first said that the silver Surfer couldn't do any of the things I listed, yet you infer a instance which the silver Surfer has those said powers and state they wouldn't phase Goku.
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You are really obsessed with trying to twist my argument into something it's not. There's nothing fallacious with stating that one of your premises was false but also proceeding to debunk an argument in which it is true. You are being obnoxiously circuitous.
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So after I have actually stated what prowess the Silver Surfer contains, you wish to backtrack and now state that my original standpoint was a simple concept. Yes, I am "twisting" your arm. Often times so many people get caught up in the heat of the debate that they simply don't see the mistakes that lead to their downfall. Please can we stay on topic.
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Oh sweet science the irony. You are so lost here it's not funny anymore. Please regale me; Where have I backtracked in any way? What claim have I even implied a retraction of? You're not twisting any arms pal. You're twisting your own delusion. Since I know you'll fail to keep up yet again let me make it very simple. Your claim that the Silver Surfer can punch Goku and turn him into an animal is simply false because he lacks the physical ability. Your claim that he could go back in time and prevent Goku's growth and development is false not only because he lacks the ability but because he wouldn't know to do that. I'm not unaware of the powers of the Silver Surfer.
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"I never said he could time travel I only implied that he had a portion of the power to use it..." That quote may not be exact but you can see the message being implied. If you knew of Silver Surfer's powers then you would understand that he has only a fraction of the comic power... Could he actually arrange Goku's matter to a chimp? Debatable... Could he actually time travel? Yes, but not past eons or any large time interval such as that. You also said that I was twisting your arm, but now I'm not twisting your arm and twisting my own arm into delusion. Do you actually understand what you are saying or are you allowing your emotions to shroud your visual sense?
