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Edited by Lost Sols: 1/17/2016 12:27:43 AM
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The Days Have Turned... (Destiny's Will to Death)

Hope is a funny thing. It can get you to the next day, but it can also lead to disappointment. Destiny was built and marketed on hope and each day we wait for that hope to be realized and each day it slips further away. A year and a half ago, we had the hope of what Destiny would be. Five months ago we had the hope of year 2. Two weeks ago we had the hope of a new calendar year. Yesterday the forums, reddit and gaming sites were once again aflame with the absolute train wreck that is the state of the crucible, the endless lag, connection issues and yet another broken (Nightfall) Strike. How have we gotten here? Year one for all its flaws and for all this game wasn't in terms of the giant explorable solar system many of us expected, was still immensely fun. If there was one complaint to rule them all in year one it was accessibility and the lack of built in matchmaking features. There was this amazing content in the VoG and it was like an actual job to try to group up to play it. Yes there were other issues like Vault space, zoo errors, bad economies and initially the loss of vanilla gear with TDB, but the strikes were all fun, PvP was a blast and the weapons were phenomenal. Year 2 had problems from the start. First with wonky pricing and making year one players re-buy content to get bonus exclusives, to eventually gutting the game for anyone who didn't purchase the expansion. For a lot of players that was the jumping off point, but for those who purchased TTK, it really had a lot to offer at the start. The new content (yes it can be debated what constitutes "new" as the Dreadnaught was later found to be the original final level) offered more story than we'd gotten in all of year one. The new missions and strikes were fun. The gunsmith and Armsday were a fresh addition. The new subclasses were all a blast and the overall presentation was smoother with the changes to bounty and quest logs. After my playtime in HoW dropping to mainly just Iron Banner when it would roll around, I was back to playing all the time and it started out pretty great until I leveled up all 3 new subclasses. That’s when it first became apparent that unless you had a raid group or wanted to wade into the epeening world of LFG, there was about 4 days worth of meaningful content to run a week and after that there were basically almost no marks or meaningful rewards to acquire until the next reset. When TTK dropped, one of the things that immediately jumped out was how freely purples (and with 3oC, exotics as well) flowed compared to year one. From the first 3 strikes of the week, to Armsday requisitions, it seemed we'd find great gear much easier. The reality ended up being something quite a bit different. In year one I was constantly finding new things to try and they'd become my new favorite. Cryptic Dragon Suros MIDA B-Line Trauma Vanquisher Up for Anything Three Little Words Coiled Hiss Hygeia Noblesse Na3d1 Salvation State Plug One Wizard 77 Plan C Truth Dragons Breath (I liked it) Gjally LDR (all 3 elements) Saterienne Rapier Icebreaker Abyss Defiant Every time something new dropped, it had the potential to be great and not only that, but unique versions of them would drop. I still have 3 Coiled Hiss, one with 3rd Eye, one with glass half full and one the perfect balance laser from the vendor. The weapons year one (and particularly once they introduced Etheric Light to bring forward vanilla gear) were beyond awesome. Year 2 saw us lose all that, but there was the hope that the new gear would prove even better. Instead, 5 months into TTK (yeah, it's been that long), I still not only have yet to find weapons I like or that work as well as my year one weapons, but the semi-decent shit I do find, I can't get with perk rolls I want. Seriously, I've leveled up DO probably 30 times since TTK dropped and not one time have I gotten a Hung Jury in a rewards package. I don't -blam!-ing want Firefly; I want Full Auto, 3rd Eye and/or Explosive Rounds. Same for Last Extremity, hasn't -blam!-ing dropped. It's like the game sees I don't use shotguns, Sidearms or Hand Cannons and gives me them every single -blam!-ing time. 5 month into this Expansion my main weapon is still Last Extremity and I barely used it last IB because of the stupid nerfs that made using Scouts "a crutch". Literally everything I use regularly I got within the first 2 weeks of TTK dropping. Bungie will take that and turn it into their vindication for all the tragic weapon "balancing" they've done, but the fact of the matter is that over the first 8 months this game was out until they decided to completely -blam!- ARs, I used more and loved more weapons in this game than I have in all the time since. When Destiny launched anything was viable. Special ammo was basically infinite and yet I used my primary 90% of the time in PvP. It wasn't until ARs were nerfed that the dawn of the shotgun descended upon us and it's been one painful debacle after another since. I'm not going to go into that full history here as there are enough threads about Weisnewski and his pathological destruction, but the fact is that 5 months into TTK there just aren't any interesting weapons to acquire (even raid gear) and the few that are somewhat interesting either have been nerfed to the point of being pointless or are just not worth the endless grind trying to get versions with perks that just won't ever drop. And that unfortunately brings us to the final straw that's broken year 2 which is all the content that we did love and that was great that was left behind. And no, not just all the amazing gear and weapons. Winter's Run Summoning Pit Devil's Lair The Nexus VoG Crota's End PoE Flaming -blam!-ing Skulls Nightfall XP bonuses Yeah we got Sparrow Racing and it was fun, but it wasn't enough to counter this last weapon patch that was the final straw for a lot of people or the way TTK has failed to evolve and add to its initial promise [i]at all[/i]. [quote]Inscrutable loot filled fortress[/quote] I bet I haven't been to the dreadnaught in a month and a half. I know Bungie read our posts and I genuinely believe that some like Cozmo, the artists, programmers and designers probably care immensely about this game, but I'm not sure anymore that the passions of those who pour their hearts into this game are enough to overcome the minds of those determined to shape it into the twisted caricature it's become. I don't know DeeJ personally, but we all know he doesn't play Destiny. I have no doubt that Mr. Weisnewski is a grand fellow irl, but I hold him more responsible for making this game unplayable than anyone else. So what are the answers and what can fix this? CONTENT AND FUN. Two things that have been ripped from this game at every turn. We never got more powerful, we got nerfed. We didn't find new worlds to explore; we were forced to abandon those we loved. We’ve all been on this roller coaster together for a long time now and those who’ve stayed on the ride and those who’ve jumped off… We all still want the same thing. We want Destiny to be great and even when we spend less time in-game, we’re still here because this community is made up of so many people who genuinely care and want this game to be better and keep hoping Bungie isn’t just listening, but actually taking our thoughts and feedback to heart. It's time to bring back the old content. It's time to make year one strikes and raids relevant again. It's time to roll back all the weapon balancing (the road to hell is paved with those well intentioned patches). IT'S TIME TO BRING FORWARD ALL YEAR ONE WEAPONS and it's time to let us play how we want to play and not how some dev wants us to play this month, because I can tell you right now, I have played exactly once since the last IB ended and it just pissed me off to use the wreck that are weapons in 2.0.1 I have said before that I understand that 90% of Bungie are working on Destiny 2 and I hope to God that they are learning from the sins of this release, but that does not excuse year 2 being butchered and left to die. Hope. It's a funny thing and it's sad watching it die.

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  • Edited by Razzupaltuff: 1/15/2016 4:23:31 PM
    Lost Sols, I believe that what you fail to see is that a lot of Destiny players are playing Destiny far more casually than you seem to do, and have a far less demanding attitude towards it. For them, it's not that one game with awesome potential they want to see living up to that potential. It's one game among many for them. I just need to look at my son. He is playing Fallout 4, Ark Evolved, Armored Warfare, Star Wars Battlefront, Minecraft, and in between a bit Destiny. The world doesn't end for him because Destiny is not what people were made to believe it would be (yes, in my book, Destiny players were lied to by Bungie on a regular base). The people visiting these forums are a microscopically small fraction of the people playing (or having played) Destiny. That is true for every other game, too. Most people do not care enough, or do not notice the flaws of a game enough, to be bothered trying to change something about it. Destiny is not the only game with a promising formula that is never being brought to its full potential. I know more of these. Yet people keep purchasing and playing them, and aren't very disappointed if a game is, well, disappointing. They move on. That's what people telling you to move on because it's only a game are trying to tell you. They are also asking you whether there is so little besides Destiny that makes your life worthwile that you need to fight so hard for Destiny to become what you desire it to be. You should evaluate your position towards Destiny and ask yourself what is making you fight so passionately for the changes you would like to see being made to it, instead of moving on to greener (or at least different) pastures. A part of the answer may lie in the way Destiny has been built to exploit and manipulate the human brain's reward system. The only way to break out of the habit and desires that has been causing is to deliberately put Destiny aside and keep your mind occupied with other things until you have learned to enjoy these again and are not craving for your daily dose of Destiny's skinner box reward system anymore. Back to numbers. Bungie is seeing the millions of players playing, or having played Destiny, and the revenue that has brought them. The few people complaining in the forums are only a drop in that ocean. They do not need to care about them. Even if their behavior is objectively immoral, they can afford to go on with it, and believe me: There are many, many people in the business world who act exactly like that with great success.

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    • Oh well hello there

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      • Unless 2 is way different ill opt out of getting sucked in again. I imagine destiny 2 as all the same planets except the dreadnaught. Nothing new. My hopes are wayyyy down lol

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      • Honestly, this is probably the best post I've seen in the forums. The last couple paragraphs were perfectly on point. The devs need to realize that taking everything from us will drive us away. 85% of the game I loved is gone. If 2 doesn't bring it back, I will be gone. Great post Sols. Bump.

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        • First I have to admit I'm a destiny lover and daily player , it's my go to game .....that being said . Every single word you typed is spot on , every word . I love vog , we contemplate running it but why ? Fun ? Yea try telling that to a friend list populated with 320 chasers .... I also follow every press release , every update and read every single patch note in detail and yeah , for the most part they are full of crap .... ALOT .... I will still play daily , I will still chase the grind but I hope their expectations of themselves is as high as mine from them ......

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        • BUMP!

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        • Destiny is boring now for the vast majority of there players. They have 9 percent of there players showing as completing the Kings fall raid. They killed destiny with there choice to make a game for 9 percent of there players. We all know what most of the other 91 percent want from BUNGIE but they won't do anything we want with Luke smith calling the shots. BUNGIE has failed 91 percent of its destiny players..... But congrats on making a game for the other 9 percent. Bloody bunch of plonkers.

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          • The only reason I start up destiny anymore is to play trials. Even that is getting hard to do anymore from all the lag and red bar. Sigh

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            • ;-;

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            • Edited by DarthV0ider: 1/15/2016 11:46:17 PM
              Wow, Sols, great post! Nicely written and passionate. I've gone from loving Destiny to hating it (stopped playing at TTK's release; refused to pay $40 for one new "planet"), to now feeling honestly sad at it's current state. Even the die-hard YouTube content creators have branched out, as Bungie simply made an error in not bringing Year 1 content forward. I feel bad for the PvP dominant players, as I hear the Crucible is a shameful mess these days. I feel for Weisnewski as I think he's really trying; Bungie just got stuck in nerf-mode ever since the first Auto-rifle and Mythoclast nerf, and were never able to get the meta back to balanced again. Hell, I bet most Year 2 guardians don't even know what the Mythoclast is, and that's sad. Once one of the crown jewels of any Guardian's arsenal, it's been relegated to history, along with the mighty Gjallahorn, the beloved Fatebringer and Vision of Confluence (pronounced DPJ-style, "Confwooence), and finally, hope for Destiny 1. Bungie is, I believe, supremely confident that Destiny 2 will sell like OG Kush in Colorado. As you said, most of their eggs are in that basket, or as the Bungie-Activision contact stated (based on hitting certain sales metrics), split in between Destiny 2, whatever Bungie *actually* wants to work on (Marathon reboot?), and the "Live Team", which I'm guessing is an over-worked skeleton crew being asked to create content with one-hand tied behind their backs (look at all the re-skinned weapons; that's not the work of a fully engaged creative team. That's the work of a restrictive budget, imo). Nothing to do but wait and see.

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            • Bravo!!!![b] Increase the power! I want to hear the cries of a future being born! [/b]

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            • I played one time this week. I am/was a hardcore destiny player up until now. The fact that the community is instead of evolving into new metas, we are devolving back into last word and shotguns. I have been playing games on my PS2 that have more content than destiny even with these "expansions". Speaking of which, expansions are supposed to expand the game. These expansions have less content than call of duty map packs. I hope that whatever is coming February will make me come back. If not, I hope Destiny 2 will. I wish bungie would look at the majority and not the minority. EVERYONE wants more, but there must be a guy named greg thats in charge saying "Theres too much conent, i can barely keep up". This game has destroyed my will to respect bungie. What happened to the expansive stories that were the halo games am i right? They did so well and then we get this shit on a stick of a game. Sorry for the rant but this is what i have to say. [spoiler]Theres nothing to spoil, there's no story to spoil[/spoiler]

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            • Very good post! ...and once again a cool song in this clip too ,) Bump!

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            • Another day, another bump

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            • 35
              5 months ago I stood at the threshold of year 2 and thought to myself, "the disappointment end here. TTK will be a masterpiece." Man, was I wrong. Destiny has always had greatness cut out; great gameplay, great art, fantastic classes. But all of that is wasted on insufficient content, half-assed RPG elements, repetitive encounters and empty, uninteresting worlds. Now, the things that the game got right are slowly being uprooted. The weapons which were once great are becoming increasingly more insignificant and weak. The loot that we looked forward to on a daily basis is now stale and underwhelming. And all we worked towards; what does it mean now? Shit. It means shit. Throughout year 1, I made it my mission to acquire the following: -3 gjallarhorns -3 icebreakers -3 no lands beyond (cause why not) -3 fatebringers -3 black hammers -3 swordbreakers -at least one of every other raid weapon -dry rot 32 -ash factory -EVERY YEAR 1 EXOTIC I raided the vault and CE three times a week. I blasted through the nightfall every tuesday. Even when I got some dumb reward, it was still fun. Not only is it far less rewarding now, it is so much less fun. An expansion is supposed to build on the game, build on the player experience and give them more to do, while leaving the rest of the game in tact. Instead, we paid $40 to have our player experience ripped from our accounts, buried under the rubble, and replaced with something that is but a shell of what it used to be. A fraction of the content. A fraction of the variety. A fraction of the fun.

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              • Most of what you asked for at the end helps players from ttk forward, I prefer to help all people who bought it, I'm calling for a complete reboot, as it is the only option I see that helps everyone. I do want to say that this is the Sol I remember, the one who used reason and wisdom to make a statement about the crisis we are in an wanted it to improve, the other Sol was caught up in playing new content from the ttk that he didn't see the same bungled maneuvers being put into place. Just want to say, nicely done.

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              • Great Post, i loved this game when i first started playing but Bungies underhanded business tactics and total disrespect for it's customers has stopped me playing. RIP destiny

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              • Bump!

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              • Newsk is a piece of shit who tries to spin all his weapon nerfs by claiming that they are working as intended, and it's just the dumb ass players that can't figure it out. He's a prick.

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