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Edited by Lost Sols: 1/17/2016 12:27:43 AM
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The Days Have Turned... (Destiny's Will to Death)

Hope is a funny thing. It can get you to the next day, but it can also lead to disappointment. Destiny was built and marketed on hope and each day we wait for that hope to be realized and each day it slips further away. A year and a half ago, we had the hope of what Destiny would be. Five months ago we had the hope of year 2. Two weeks ago we had the hope of a new calendar year. Yesterday the forums, reddit and gaming sites were once again aflame with the absolute train wreck that is the state of the crucible, the endless lag, connection issues and yet another broken (Nightfall) Strike. How have we gotten here? Year one for all its flaws and for all this game wasn't in terms of the giant explorable solar system many of us expected, was still immensely fun. If there was one complaint to rule them all in year one it was accessibility and the lack of built in matchmaking features. There was this amazing content in the VoG and it was like an actual job to try to group up to play it. Yes there were other issues like Vault space, zoo errors, bad economies and initially the loss of vanilla gear with TDB, but the strikes were all fun, PvP was a blast and the weapons were phenomenal. Year 2 had problems from the start. First with wonky pricing and making year one players re-buy content to get bonus exclusives, to eventually gutting the game for anyone who didn't purchase the expansion. For a lot of players that was the jumping off point, but for those who purchased TTK, it really had a lot to offer at the start. The new content (yes it can be debated what constitutes "new" as the Dreadnaught was later found to be the original final level) offered more story than we'd gotten in all of year one. The new missions and strikes were fun. The gunsmith and Armsday were a fresh addition. The new subclasses were all a blast and the overall presentation was smoother with the changes to bounty and quest logs. After my playtime in HoW dropping to mainly just Iron Banner when it would roll around, I was back to playing all the time and it started out pretty great until I leveled up all 3 new subclasses. That’s when it first became apparent that unless you had a raid group or wanted to wade into the epeening world of LFG, there was about 4 days worth of meaningful content to run a week and after that there were basically almost no marks or meaningful rewards to acquire until the next reset. When TTK dropped, one of the things that immediately jumped out was how freely purples (and with 3oC, exotics as well) flowed compared to year one. From the first 3 strikes of the week, to Armsday requisitions, it seemed we'd find great gear much easier. The reality ended up being something quite a bit different. In year one I was constantly finding new things to try and they'd become my new favorite. Cryptic Dragon Suros MIDA B-Line Trauma Vanquisher Up for Anything Three Little Words Coiled Hiss Hygeia Noblesse Na3d1 Salvation State Plug One Wizard 77 Plan C Truth Dragons Breath (I liked it) Gjally LDR (all 3 elements) Saterienne Rapier Icebreaker Abyss Defiant Every time something new dropped, it had the potential to be great and not only that, but unique versions of them would drop. I still have 3 Coiled Hiss, one with 3rd Eye, one with glass half full and one the perfect balance laser from the vendor. The weapons year one (and particularly once they introduced Etheric Light to bring forward vanilla gear) were beyond awesome. Year 2 saw us lose all that, but there was the hope that the new gear would prove even better. Instead, 5 months into TTK (yeah, it's been that long), I still not only have yet to find weapons I like or that work as well as my year one weapons, but the semi-decent shit I do find, I can't get with perk rolls I want. Seriously, I've leveled up DO probably 30 times since TTK dropped and not one time have I gotten a Hung Jury in a rewards package. I don't -blam!-ing want Firefly; I want Full Auto, 3rd Eye and/or Explosive Rounds. Same for Last Extremity, hasn't -blam!-ing dropped. It's like the game sees I don't use shotguns, Sidearms or Hand Cannons and gives me them every single -blam!-ing time. 5 month into this Expansion my main weapon is still Last Extremity and I barely used it last IB because of the stupid nerfs that made using Scouts "a crutch". Literally everything I use regularly I got within the first 2 weeks of TTK dropping. Bungie will take that and turn it into their vindication for all the tragic weapon "balancing" they've done, but the fact of the matter is that over the first 8 months this game was out until they decided to completely -blam!- ARs, I used more and loved more weapons in this game than I have in all the time since. When Destiny launched anything was viable. Special ammo was basically infinite and yet I used my primary 90% of the time in PvP. It wasn't until ARs were nerfed that the dawn of the shotgun descended upon us and it's been one painful debacle after another since. I'm not going to go into that full history here as there are enough threads about Weisnewski and his pathological destruction, but the fact is that 5 months into TTK there just aren't any interesting weapons to acquire (even raid gear) and the few that are somewhat interesting either have been nerfed to the point of being pointless or are just not worth the endless grind trying to get versions with perks that just won't ever drop. And that unfortunately brings us to the final straw that's broken year 2 which is all the content that we did love and that was great that was left behind. And no, not just all the amazing gear and weapons. Winter's Run Summoning Pit Devil's Lair The Nexus VoG Crota's End PoE Flaming -blam!-ing Skulls Nightfall XP bonuses Yeah we got Sparrow Racing and it was fun, but it wasn't enough to counter this last weapon patch that was the final straw for a lot of people or the way TTK has failed to evolve and add to its initial promise [i]at all[/i]. [quote]Inscrutable loot filled fortress[/quote] I bet I haven't been to the dreadnaught in a month and a half. I know Bungie read our posts and I genuinely believe that some like Cozmo, the artists, programmers and designers probably care immensely about this game, but I'm not sure anymore that the passions of those who pour their hearts into this game are enough to overcome the minds of those determined to shape it into the twisted caricature it's become. I don't know DeeJ personally, but we all know he doesn't play Destiny. I have no doubt that Mr. Weisnewski is a grand fellow irl, but I hold him more responsible for making this game unplayable than anyone else. So what are the answers and what can fix this? CONTENT AND FUN. Two things that have been ripped from this game at every turn. We never got more powerful, we got nerfed. We didn't find new worlds to explore; we were forced to abandon those we loved. We’ve all been on this roller coaster together for a long time now and those who’ve stayed on the ride and those who’ve jumped off… We all still want the same thing. We want Destiny to be great and even when we spend less time in-game, we’re still here because this community is made up of so many people who genuinely care and want this game to be better and keep hoping Bungie isn’t just listening, but actually taking our thoughts and feedback to heart. It's time to bring back the old content. It's time to make year one strikes and raids relevant again. It's time to roll back all the weapon balancing (the road to hell is paved with those well intentioned patches). IT'S TIME TO BRING FORWARD ALL YEAR ONE WEAPONS and it's time to let us play how we want to play and not how some dev wants us to play this month, because I can tell you right now, I have played exactly once since the last IB ended and it just pissed me off to use the wreck that are weapons in 2.0.1 I have said before that I understand that 90% of Bungie are working on Destiny 2 and I hope to God that they are learning from the sins of this release, but that does not excuse year 2 being butchered and left to die. Hope. It's a funny thing and it's sad watching it die.

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  • Bump

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  • HERE HERE

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  • Great post sols. Time reveals all.

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  • Bump. We expect them to learn as things go. They should repeat the things we enjoyed and they should not repeat their mistakes. TTK has done the exact opposite. Everyone loved in HoW how you could ascend any gear to the new cap because that created MORE options. NOBODY, even those who claim to support the decision to make Y1 gear obsolete, actually ENJOYS the fact that we had to leave Y1 gear behind. They should learn from the HoW era that they NEED to let us ascend Y1 gear. They also apparently learned in HoW that we loved our elemental primaries because they started giving them to us as random rewards for killing Skolas. Yet they took them away in Y2 without so much as a decent explanation why. We loved how the nightfall worked in Y1 and how the strikelists worked in general, but they cut that up, rehashed it, and now the strike playlist is like a Frankenstein monster. It's simply too repetitive and not rewarding enough to warrant playing anymore. Once you reach the endgame phase, that leaves essentially 2 options: PVP and the raid. PVP : We all know the complaints. Weapon imbalance, laggers, cheaters, etc. It seems like with every patch this just gets worse. Even with that in mind, I still enjoyed playing it now and then because I could play with the weapons I actually LIKE (Y1 weapons) rather than garbage Y2 weapons. But that is not even really true for my absolute FAVORITE weapon: Patience/Time. This weapon was by no means a PVP/PVE gamebreaker, yet it is STILL not in TTK. I can't even start to guess why as they have yet to explain how they pick and choose which exotics to bring forward. My guess? Dartboard. And that brings me to the raid. My first time through the raid was amazing. I found the jumping puzzles fun, figuring out the raid myself rather than having others teach it to me was a great experience. But after I beat the raid, when all was said and done, my team was burnt out on the game. We did what we set out to do. But the rewards from the raid simply do not match the efforts and we see no reason to continue grinding it out, as our gear will become obsolete AGAIN when the next installment of Destiny comes out. Why grind for 320? It makes no difference anymore, it takes WAY too much effort, and there's not enough reward there. I carved out my legend in Y1, I don't need to prove it again by completing a thankless raid over and over again in Y2 when I'm not enjoying my gaming experience anymore. And with Luke Smith or anyone that matters actively avoiding questions for people who actually play there game, I see no hope that this game will go in the right direction. All I see is that they're going to repeat the same mistakes they keep making, and they won't allow repetition of the things we like. I would end this rant with a typical "Guardian Down" message, but the fact is I still play about 1-2x a week when people ask me for help. But that's it. I log my gaming hours on other games that I actually enjoy playing. Until everyone else on my friendslist drops this game like the bad habit it is, this is pretty much going to be the pattern well into the future.

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    • Hey LS. If you haven't heard [i]Circle[/i] by Big Head Todd and the Monsters, check it out. One of my favorite songs from one of my favorite bands. Lyrics are fitting.

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      • It would be nice to choose from a wealth of end game content instead of grinding Kings Fall. No weapon from any of the older raids posed a serious balancing problem in PVP.

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      • You can't get a hung jury with full auto. The options available are here: http://db.planetdestiny.com/items/view/1475134443

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        • Oh and spot on stuff as always. Bump Don't know if you remember awhile back I asked if you played guitar.

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          • and this sums up why I haven't played destiny in months.

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            • please UPGRADE arena and raids because we will all flee destiny

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            • Great post. Y2 is absolutely horrific. I'd like to say that Bungie management, decision makers, or whatever they maybe are seriously hurting this game. The hoards of programmers are not to blame. They don't make the decisions, they just code them. Herald Ryan, Luke Smith, that gun guy you mention, they all have a direct hand in ruining a wet dream. One of Bungie's biggest issues is they're refusal of the MMORPG genre. This has effected communication. MMO devs communicate better as well as plan better. When IB came out for the first time after TTK released they completely screwed up rewards. They encouraged players to grind for gear and after everything was said and done no one got shit. Bungie's response? "Whoops". Whoops doesn't cut it. Whoops and here's rank 4 and 5 players free <insert item>. People wasted their time based on Bungie's mistake and Bungie did -blam!- all to fix it. Honestly Bungie needs to cut some decision makers. Replace them with individuals with a clue, the capacity to genuinely accept they can have bad ideas, the capacity to let go of bad ideas, and an understanding of MMOs.

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              • *Sighs* I wish this game had everything they promised when destiny came out me and all my friends loved it until we finished the story then there was the collective what now? And this has been the question that I think needs to be addresed the crucible is no fun what so ever trials is only on the weekend you could run crota or vog or poe but what's the point anymore kings fall isn't that fun imo so ya just a boring game at the moment also soles eat a pine cone

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              • Bump

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              • Edited by theghost_bgrt: 1/14/2016 5:02:10 PM
                Lol responded to wrong post

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              • I'm still looking for that inscrutable loot filled fortress? Maybe my TTK edition is missing that part? Otherwise, great post Sols!!

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                • Bump

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                • Ninjas keep tabs on sols post lol and the comments.

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                  • I'm glad you're still here, Sols. I took a break several months ago and just came back to see if it was okay to come back yet. I see this post. See you all in a few more months!

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                    • Best post i've read for a long time, played Destiny since beta, and the hope you described I guess was a major factor as to what kept me playing Destiny, and only Destiny since it's release. The last weps "balancing" patch, I truly dreaded, every time bungie applied a weps balance they consistently made one weapon stand above all else in crucible. Whether intentional or not, it meant diversity in pvp was just an idea, 90% of players using the same weapon. The last time I played Destiny I jumped into IB two days after bungies patch and it was the final straw, mida everywhere. Although I still cling to the hope things will improve in both pve & pvp, i'll not play Destiny again until good folk like yourself posting on these forums give me the go ahead. I can't wrap my head around why everybody takes a month off when there are so many problems to attend to, and now even more, crucible by all accounts is nigh on unplayable at the moment, lag, players dying for no reason, hit detection is all over the shop, floating guardians, dying upon activation of supers. Destiny has to be hemorrhaging players, does bungie care enough to cut their sabbatical short?? Does'nt seem like they ever cared tbh. I'll keep an eye on the forums, no doubt, but have purchased other games that i've been playing in the meantime.

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                    • While I have disagreed and agreed with you in the past, Sols; this has to be the finest post of yours that I have ever read. Very well done. If I ever stop referencing back to this post, assume I've died.

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                      • You smart you very smart you loyal greatful i appreciate you.

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                      • Super-bump. You really have a way with words, Sols. You always seem to capture just what folks are feeling.

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                        • The thing that bothers me the most is Bungie's "season philosophy" for weapons. They think every weapon type should have a time where it dominates, which is retarded. If you want to not be at a disadvantage, you have to run Last Word/MIDA for primary and CTD/1000YS for your secondary. Four. Four guns that are having their "season" while everything else gets shit on. Great.

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                          • "Hope for the future". By Paul McCartney. Flagship song and Really sums up this game perfectly. There is an insatiable demand for more content that the studio knows they cannot satisfy. However I see that as an ode to the quality of the game. If destiny actually sucked people would stop playing and not care. They don't though. They come here and complain that they want more to do. Sure most people are a bit crude, there are more conspiracy theories and accusations of greed and fraud than we can count. Personally I think people give Bungie wayyyy too much credit as evil geniuses. They are just a bunch of human beings doing the best they can to put out more content but it takes time. In the end, Luke Smith said it best. They welcome the criticism because they know it means people are protective of something they love. Frankly I'm OK with destiny being a part time game. I actually have a life and other games I play. I enjoy Destiny when I do play it but I definitely don't overdo it. I think the idea of a "hardcore" player has passed. There is no longer the urge to get in 3 raids and 3 nightfalls every week. That is a GOOD thing IMO. I will continue to support the game and future releases because I enjoy it. People on this forum spend toooo much time complaining about nonsense. If that's how they want to live their life I can't stop them but I pity them. At the end of the day, it is a video game. There are far more important things in everyone's life, if your priorities are not straight that's on you. You need to develop a more "go with the flow" mindset. (Not directed at you Sols, just the majority of the forum in general)

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                            • Although some white knights may not agree with you, you make some dam good points and these are things the developers need to touch on ASAP!

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