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Edited by Jet The Pirate:
3/25/2016 10:58:27 PM
255
Sunsingers op?!?! If so then so are nightstalkers.
Okay, so ive seen alot of posts about Sunsingers and how "op" they are and its getting annoying.
Lets compare the infamous firebolt with the hunters "Wombo combo".
[u][i]Firebolt[/i][/u]
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- Does a TOTAL of *** damage, not enough to kill even the lowest of armored guardians.(SEE EDIT)
-Has DoT for around 12 seconds (some say 14, some say 10)
-Firebolt has an 8m radius in which it tags.
[b][i]EDIT[/i][/b]
[quote] [b][i][u]I just tested it and got the clip. When its active in around 10 mins ill post the link.
Initial tag for 85 damage.
11 ticks of 7 for DoT.
85+77 is 162.
My bad, i was off by 5.
This was tested on the lowest armor build a voidwalker can run.[/u][/i][/b][/quote]
[u][i]LINK TO FIREBOLT TEST http://xboxclips.com/Jet+The+Pirate/5c204455-581f-454f-b4ad-0bee431986b3[/i][/u]
Good for crowd control and good defensive technique. Does allow "tracking" by watching the DoT BUUUUUT warlocks are the slowest and clunkiest race so it is harder to chase the enemy. <---- thats called trade off. Warlocks can be situationally amazing and of course they will be harder to kill.. its a defensive subclass and is built that way.
[u][i]Wombo Combo[/i][/u]
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-Takes away radar
-cuts movement speed by 50%
-does damage
-blinds the enemy visually
-locks abilities, supers, charged melees and jumps
^-----thats just the "Smoke" portion of the grenade.
Their void grenade choices all do damage and can visually impair other guardians trying to see or shoot through it.
BUT wombo requires both grenades to be thrown to be 100% effective. Dont forget how they [i]can[/i] be thrown virtually simultaneously.
Its trade off. If the hunters had all of that in just ONE grenade then theyd actually be op.. but they aren't.
TL;DR
[b][i][u]Neither are op and excel in certain situations better then other subclasses. But if you proceed to call one of them op in anyway then you HAVE to consider the other one as such.[/u][/i][/b]
[b][i]Edit: So it seems alot of people are misunderstanding my point.
Im NOT saying firebolt and wombo is the same style or do the same things. What i AM saying is that most who consider firebolt "op" due to just its DoT must thrn consider wombo as "op" because wombo has 4 times the effects on an enemy and while it does take 2 charges, its also on a character that is faster then warlocks, has access to an evade and keen scout.
You cant consider something op due to one fact while ignoring classes that have alot of advantages similar in concept.[/i][/b]
[b][i][u]Edit:[/u][/i][/b] [b][i][u]Alot of people keep saying that firebolts leave you at one shot. My response:[b][i]how many other grenades do that? It doesnt matter HOW they do it, just THAT theydo it.[/i][/b] [/u][/i][/b]
[u][i][b][u]EDIT: SUNSINGER OP? CHECK THIS SHIT OUT.
https://youtu.be/VM-SwPcMIwE[/u][/b][/i][/u]
Its just as strong imo.
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5 RepliesFirbolts are actuly op omly beacuse the long burn time also arc bolt is garbage mow cause they weakend it to give it to stormcaller
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3 RepliesWombo isn't even good lol. And it takes melee and grenade charge. Which duo is better, vortex nade and smoke melee that if thrown in quick succession can help you get a single kill, or firebolt nade with viking funeral and overshield melee? And I don't even run nightstalker, Gunslinger since day 1
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2 RepliesOkay nerf both of them Problem solved
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4 RepliesFirebolt can hit around corners is the big thing. Throw it from safety. Rush in with knowledge of their position and 10 seconds of them being 1 shot...
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5 RepliesQuietly awaits for my inbound Voidwalker buff.
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1 ReplyIts not that firebolts are op, because they aren't.....it's the fact that they leave you vulnerable for so long, giving the enemy a great chance to kill you considering they can see exactly where u are, and you have to wait a while before you stop burning, then wait for your shields to recharge. Wombo Combo is tough to fight, but it still gives a chance to escape as long as the grenade AND the smoke doesn't hit 100% on. So in point, the grenade isn't the reason people are asking nerf, the reason why people are frustrated is because it leaves them vulnerable for such a long time allowing anybody who sees them to practically kill them with 2 shots.
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1 ReplyI'm not even gonna read your post, I'm just here to say, in regards to your thread title; THAT'S NOT HOW THINGS WORK. [quote]If that apple is a fruit then so is a walrus[/quote]
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3 RepliesOk...let's use your logic and let's compare the same Sunsinger using a melee charge to get his ON-HIT overshield AND then using a grenade charge with the same Nightstalker using JUST a grenade charge and then tell me which one is stronger. That is literally the comparison you just made
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As I said before. Put a sunsinger head to head against any other sublass (except titan bubble) and it will very much more than likely lose. It's a shame that when people find a good way to exploit a skill, they consider it overpowered just because they cant compete against it. I've been killed from hammers and golden guns and everything else a lot more than actually killing with grenades and melee, and I think other sunsingers will agree with me. If your lucky enough to hit someone with more than one grenade you may kill them, you may burn them to death, if you can get close enough you might be able to melee them, but like i said, compare that against a 1 hit hammer kill or golden gun or arc blade or ANYTHING. All I'm saying is, you don't see sunsingers complaining about all other classes to make up for the lack of attack power/ability for their own subclass. Good sunsingers tend to make what they have work for them, and that's why I've said before, there's good sunsingers, and then there's sunsingers who don't get it, but to each his own.
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3 RepliesYou forgot to say that Firebolts are a no skill grenade and with the wombo-combo you need to do a precise throw
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6 RepliesYou throw firebolt 10 meters away from where you actually wanted to throw it , it will still tag the enemies and do a 162 damage so who's getting rewarded for a bad grenade placement. On the other hand smoke or the grenade alone can't kill , you can just step aside and avoid it. You have to throw it directly on the target to take out atleast half of their health. Smoke + grenade is not a guranteed kill unless your grenade and smoke placement is good.
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2 RepliesYou have awful logic
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1 ReplyEdited by Desiato: 3/25/2016 7:31:49 PMI appreciate you trying to bridge the divide between the playerbase. Unfortunately I feel like the biggest factor here is the fact, in addition to using two charges, wombo combo has to be a great deal more precise in its execution, entails actually[b] looking [/b]at the person you're doing it to, and doesn't track. Firebolts can be thrown around a corner, tracks (as in homing, not the DoT "tracking" that lets you see them through walls) every class apart from nightstalker, in addition to the insane 14 seconds that it takes you out of the game. One shot and a firebolt and you're done. It doesn't matter what class you are. You're dead, end of story. Ask yourself how many times in the crucible you actually get killed by wombo combo. How many times do you get killed by a firebolt? Sunsingers are on every single competitive team for a reason. They alone set the subclass cap in sweats.
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1 ReplyEverything's OP in this game it's meant for casuals what'd u expect
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1 ReplyI agree.
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1 ReplyThey both deserve to be nerfed. I shouldn't be kicked out of a firefight for 12-14 seconds because your Firebolt grenade landed in the same timezone as me. (I'm fine with the damage, I want it to happen [u]faster[/u]) Smoke nade shouldn't take away radar or jump, nor should it slow by that much. The Nightstalker grenades are awful by themselves.
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4 RepliesWombo requires two perks, and your gernade and melee charge. Fire bolt just requires two perks. Generally...when A LOT of people are all complaining about the same thing...it's a problem.
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2 RepliesShut up meg
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1 ReplyDon't mind me, I'm just here to shoot marshmallows and throw pixie dust while I have a pillow fight with my opponents.
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1 ReplyAlso, nightstalker smoke grenade can't be used in close quarters, as it triggers regular melee attack
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2 RepliesHonestly I don't think the smokes should get to blind you. They already stop you in your tracks and damage you which makes you a sitting duck, so not being able to see on top of that is just unfair. I'd be okay with blindness being a selectable perk though (as an alternative to envenomed and vanish in smoke. Snare sucks anyway.) That is basically the only tweak I have for this game right now as far as class balance is concerned.
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2 RepliesEdited by VoltageSky: 3/24/2016 12:37:03 AMWarlocks are getting nerfed, cry all you want, I'll be back on the 12th to check for another post of you crying. Cya in a few weeks.
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4 RepliesFocus burst and triple tap moves faster than double jump.
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6 RepliesWhat the Wombo Combo suppresses supers? Hmm didn't know I could Wombo Combo a Storm Caller and it take their super away? [spoiler]I would still get fried as if I was fighting Raiden himself.[/spoiler]
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2 RepliesHow many other grenades do that? Many. My question for you is how many grenades do that no matter where in the blast you are? There are only three. The wombo combo, the firebolt, and the trip mine. Out of those, the trip mine is easy to dodge. Lightning grenades are similar, but only do 122 per hit and are easy enough to avoid the second burst.
