[quote]You don't have to chase, just simply tag and put a bullet of anything in besides and AR (which would be a few bullets) or a burst of a pulse and they're dead. Tne hunter includes both the melee and the grenade and the other is only using the grenade, therefore if gou're comparing them you must only compare the smoke. The warlock melee can 1 shot low armor builds, and burn everything else to virtually no health left all while applying DoT and giving the user a overshield. (which increases in strength when using a high armor build) Couple that with the warlocks ridiculous melee (not just the range, but also the fact it will turn 45+ degrees to hit someone for you), then you've got yourself a substantially stronger set of abilities.[/quote] Did you miss my whole point? Its called TRADE OFF. I compared to two because of the amount of effects/ease of use it takes to throw the wombo. The over shield is 50 hp so just like how you stated 1 bullet or a couple AR shots or a pulse eould finish someone off after a firebolt, that will work to break the shield. And no, the shield NEVER gets stronger. Ever. Back to your " one bullet will tinish you" point; go count how many grenades leave you at 1 shot, come bck when youre done, ill be waiting. This is such a dumb come back. I could also bring up how keen scout and shadestep have their maaaaany positives but like i said, its trade off, yes it takes two grenades BUT IT DOES MORE THEN ANY OTHER GRENADE COMBO IN THE GAME. Yes, firebolts do DoT and have a nice radius (was nerfed) but they do less damage than most grenades besides suppressor/flashbang/pulse.

They do more damage in one instance than any other grenade other than attachable grenades, and can easily tag several people. Another grenades would require the opponent to sit in the grenade for an extended period of time, which isn't nearly as useful OR consistent as easily burning your target, and keeping them weak. While the grenade smoke combo is useful, it is rather easy to be killed whilst doing it, as it requires the down time to throw 2 projectiles, and they readjust your sights for what is likely going to be around half of the targets health in gun damage. The warlocks grenade allows you to at the very least easily trade with your target, while the smoke does not. If you don't do sufficient damage, then that's it. You are almost definitely not trading with your target. Not only that, but targets can easily blink, jump, or shadestep out of smokes regardless of the fact that it suppresses your abilities. Somehow many of my targets are able to do this, and whenever a smoke is used against me I am able to fairly consistently shadestep out of it after it's started doing damage to me. And the statement "it does more than any other grenade combo in the game" is untrue, by far. Example: Super is charging defender titan, he suppressor nades the super and then proceeds to melee to death the dazed and damaged opponent. Grenade ability that comes back every 20-40 seconds beat ability that charges every few minutes. Example 2: striker titan puts 1 body shot of any scout, hand cannon, or burst of pulse rifle (any damage that's at least 30-40, if not less) into an enemy, and they melee them for a free kill. Example 3: Warlock uses grenade to tag enemy, and then (without a melee charge) melees their enemy for an instant kill, and if they have their melee charge then they get a nice little overshield with it. There are more combos that can be said, that'd be just as effective, but I'll end it there. As for your statement that shields are never stronger, this statement alone made you appear much more stupid than I could have ever imagined you being. If you have a high armor build, shields will take more bullets. Not an absolute ton more, but more. When in radiance for example, a high armor build warlock with an overshield can take a golden gun shot, and will take full clips of guns before the shield is depleted. High impact sniper shots will never headshot them, even though guns like black spindle in theory should be able to since it's a buff of 50 health if what you stated is correct. Combine this with the ram and it's even worse. As far as how many grenades will leave you one shot, the only grenades that comes to mind would be a tripmine grenade when it barely does not kill you, an incendiary grenade (which has to be a direct, or near direct hit to get someone weak enough to finish them with a body shot), or the occasional sticky grenade that fails to kill you for some reason. Everything else is damage over time. Vortex, voidwall, spike, solar, storm, and thermite grenades all require you to stand in them for either rather extended periods of time, or multiple pulses of the grenade, but which time you have likely moved out of the way if you're even kind of situationally aware. Conclusion: you're dumb, and do not actually understand the topic which you're talking so knowledgeably about.

[quote]They do more damage in one instance than any other grenade other than attachable grenades, and can easily tag several people. Another grenades would require the opponent to sit in the grenade for an extended period of time, which isn't nearly as useful OR consistent as easily burning your target, and keeping them weak. While the grenade smoke combo is useful, it is rather easy to be killed whilst doing it, as it requires the down time to throw 2 projectiles, and they readjust your sights for what is likely going to be around half of the targets health in gun damage. The warlocks grenade allows you to at the very least easily trade with your target, while the smoke does not. If you don't do sufficient damage, then that's it. You are almost definitely not trading with your target. Not only that, but targets can easily blink, jump, or shadestep out of smokes regardless of the fact that it suppresses your abilities. Somehow many of my targets are able to do this, and whenever a smoke is used against me I am able to fairly consistently shadestep out of it after it's started doing damage to me.[/Quote] Blink, shadestep and twilight will also get you out of ANY DoT situation. Do you even realize that everything youve listed is from YOUR OWN experiances? That right there makes them opinions formed by your time in the crucible. [quote]And the statement "it does more than any other grenade combo in the game" is untrue, by far. Example: Super is charging defender titan, he suppressor nades the super and then proceeds to melee to death the dazed and damaged opponent. Grenade ability that comes back every 20-40 seconds beat ability that charges every few minutes. Example 2: striker titan puts 1 body shot of any scout, hand cannon, or burst of pulse rifle (any damage that's at least 30-40, if not less) into an enemy, and they melee them for a free kill. Example 3: Warlock uses grenade to tag enemy, and then (without a melee charge) melees their enemy for an instant kill, and if they have their melee charge then they get a nice little overshield with it.[/quote] I wasn't referring to damage output or ttk. You are seriously being the most nit picky person I've met. Tell me, what other grenade combo does what nightstalker can. As in what grenade combos remove radar, blind visually, cut movement speed, do damage and lock abilities/grenades/jump/charged melees?(shadestep can because its able to dodge almost everything tracking related.) [quote]As for your statement that shields are never stronger, this statement alone made you appear much more stupid than I could have ever imagined you being. If you have a high armor build, shields will take more bullets. Not an absolute ton more, but more. When in radiance for example, a high armor build warlock with an overshield can take a golden gun shot, and will take full clips of guns before the shield is depleted. High impact sniper shots will never headshot them, even though guns like black spindle in theory should be able to since it's a buff of 50 health if what you stated is correct. Combine this with the ram and it's even worse.[/quote] You seriously are misinformed. Radiant skin is a super that REDUCES THE AMOUNT OF DAMAGE TAKEN. It does not buff your health, your shields or your charged flame shield. No where in destiny does it do that. If you are oh so sure.. go get a video showing it. No, flame shield will neverrrrr take more bullets. The only time you can take more damage is with armor increasing perks such as what the ram does. A radiant skin warlock with an increased armor chest piece, the ram and an active flame shield will tank golden gun shots/1 hammer because he has INCREASED armor. Not because his shield is ablr to take more bullets, its because of his increased armor and the DAMAGE REDUCTION during randiance. Stop being so dim eitted and validate your arguments with proof. If you want ill post links to how much armor is added with chest piece, how much damage reduction is applied during radiance and how the ram only adds plus two armor now. [quote]As far as how many grenades will leave you one shot, the only grenades that comes to mind would be a tripmine grenade when it barely does not kill you, an incendiary grenade (which has to be a direct, or near direct hit to get someone weak enough to finish them with a body shot), or the occasional sticky grenade that fails to kill you for some reason. Everything else is damage over time. Vortex, voidwall, spike, solar, storm, and thermite grenades all require you to stand in them for either rather extended periods of time, or multiple pulses of the grenade, but which time you have likely moved out of the way if you're even kind of situationally aware.[/quote] Are you serious... did you just justify every other grenades ability to leave you at 1-shot because of.. HOW they work..? You cant be serious.. All you did was literally justify and downplay based off your own opinions. If it doesn't matter HOW a grenade puts you at 1 shot ...then why does it matter HOW firebolt does? Your logic is so fragile that you have contradicted yourself multiple times. [quote]Conclusion: you're dumb, and do not actually understand the topic which you're talking so knowledgeably about.[/quote] No, you are biased and cant see past your own opinions. You have resorted to fragile minded ad hominem style tactics. Shows your immaturity, id advise fixing that.