[b]The poll will make sense towards the end.[/b] In the Paradox mission, Praedyth spoke of a deterministic "pattern," or plan that guides the Vex. Being spread out yet linked across time, the Vex knew that Oryx was coming, and they knew that he would try Taking the Vex collective mind itself. They were also convinced that this would be their end. Knowing that a threat was coming, they could have used time travel to escape this fate, but they didn't. Despite their power over time, they view their fate as unchangeable, why? [quote]So. the Vex have predicted their own annihilation...when did they believe this would happen? Can the calculations of minds the size of planets...be wrong? [...] The Vex have no hope. No imagination, no drive, no fear! All they have is the pattern. Everything must fit! If it can be made to fit, good! If it can't...it gets cut away. [...] They think this is the end of them: A path with no escape. And yet, here they are, there they were, and there they will be...and there they will have been. For them, there is no paradox. There is only the pattern. And the pattern needs the Vex to see it to completion. And so the Vex must be. For the mind of the Vex... is that faith? (Paradox mission dialogue)[/quote] Why does this pattern exist? Why would they follow it to their deaths? First I want to explain some things: [b]1) Time can be changed, as proven by the Vex.[/b] I don't know why some altering of time is allowed, and others are not allowed; it could be that they only use it as a means of correction when the timeline deviates from the pattern, or that the very use of time-alteration is explicitly in the pattern. [quote]It has begun creating a bridge through time. A bridge that if it is not destroyed, will see the Nexus Mind reborn [...] My hidden caught this attempt at abusing the timeline, but how many attempts have their been? Does the world stand as it does because of the Vex? (Echo Chamber strike dialogue)[/quote] [b]2) A paradox in time travel is when you interrupt causation (cause and effect) of events that are supposed to have happened, leading to a contradiction in time[/b]. In the case of the Vex, I believe the paradox is this: How can they exist in our past and future when they were certainly to be defeated in all of time by Oryx? [quote]They think this is the end of them: A path with no escape. And yet, here they are, there they were, and there they will be...and there they will have been. [/quote] [b]3) There are multiple timelines. This may be a way to avoid time paradoxes; [/b]the idea is the original timeline remains the same, but the altered history happens in another timeline. For example, I go back in time and kill my grandfather 70 years ago. This should mean that I am never born, but if I'm never born, how can I go back in time to kill my grandpa? The solution is that traveling back in time actually takes me to another timeline identical to the original up until my arrival. The original timeline is still unchanged where grandpa remains safe, but I am now in another timeline where I can kill alternate timeline grandpa without a paradox.[i] I don't know if timelines actually work like this though.[/i] [quote]Timelines and potentialities that might have already happened, might happen, might never happen. (Mystery: Praedyth's Door)[/quote] [b]THE COLLECTIVE MIND[/b] The Vex collective mind links all Vex across space and time, so even the very first Vex being born would be linked to the countless other units in it's future (and those time-traveling to it's past). This means even the first Vex to be born would be just as knowledgeable as a unit born billions of years from it. It would even know how to traverse time. The Vex essentially bypass any sort of need for gradual progression, making them timeless—they already know all they will ever know. [b]THE PATTERN[/b] Because they already know everything they will ever do, the Vex sees their existence as a grand plan, or "pattern," that must be enacted, and failing to follow the pattern will lead to paradoxes. I will provide an example: From the minds of Vex across time, the collective mind accesses a memory that in the year 2,740, a goblin unit picks 44 flowers. To make this event happen, the collective mind makes a goblin in the year 2,740 pick the 44 flowers, thus the memory it accessed is first created. If it didn't perform the action, then the memory would have never been created, but if it did not get created, then how was this memory there for the Vex collective mind to access? It would be a paradox. Those 44 flowers must therefore be picked for the chain of cause and effect to make sense. From this example, we understand why the Vex must follow this pattern of events. This explains why the Vex don't need drive or imagination to be so advanced. Innovation is pointless when answers already exist in the future for them to grasp. Interestingly, this creates situations where the Vex might not even act in their best interest. What practical reason would compel the Vex pick these 44 flowers from my example? Similarly, what practical reason is there for the Vex to do any of the endeavors that they know we will stop? Well, there doesn't have to be one, or even an explanation other than it's supposed to happen according to their collective memory. It is simply following the pattern. This is why the Vex did not stop Oryx from Taking them all across time; it was simply part of the plan, or pattern of their history. [b]A question remains, and it's the question for the poll. Why were the Vex so convinced that the attack of Oryx and the Taken be their end? Shouldn't they have known that a guardians would save them? POSSIBLE ANSWERS:[/b] [b]A) VEX SURVIVAL PREDETERMINED BY PATTERN [/b] - Maybe Praedyth (or his words) were manipulated to give us hope that the Vex were doomed even if we cleared the Taken, and that they always knew they would survive because of the pattern. - It could also be that Praedyth just didn't know that guardians coming to clear the Vault of Taken and saving the Vex was always part of the pattern. - It doesn't make sense how anything can be a threat to the collective mind anyway. Every moment in the past, present, and future has already happened, and exist all at once to the Vex, so they don't experience the passage of time as we do. Because the collective mind is all at once across time, it must therefore have ALWAYS functioned/STILL function/ALWAYS will function in relation to the times and positions of the Vex, or it must NEVER have functioned/NOT function/NEVER will function. We know the former is true since we've had to stop plots of the collective mind, so therefore it's unlikely that the Taken infestation could have ever been their doom. [b]B) VEX CALCULATE HIGH CHANCE OF DOOM. TIME IS PROBABILISTIC. BRANCHING TIMELINES[/b] - Since we know time can be altered, it could be that the Vex really did think they would be ended. The reason why the Vex could be so sure yet wrong might be that time is inherently non-deterministic, making the past, present, and future merely probabilistic guesses at best. There might have been was a 99.984% probability of doom, meaning the Vex are erased from 99,984/100,000 of timelines, and our timeline is just one of 16 where they do survive. - Oryx's shade and Taken would have found and Taken the Vex constructs that sends and receives information to and from all units across time. If these machines were compromised, the Vex would lose their connection, and the collective mind would dissolve in every point in time. [quote]But still, they do what they do, the world-minds of the collective passing instructions across time. (Not Forged in Light quest, step Approach the Black Garden)[/quote] - Probabilistic time makes sense to me; the quantum particles that make up all matter behave in a probabilistic way, so even if you rewind time to replay an event without changing anything, it could go differently on at least on a tiny quantum scale. Those tiny differences might build up to large changes if you're lucky or unlucky. An alternate timeline could exist for every result of the quantum dice roll. [b]C) THE VEX WERE 100% DOOMED, BUT GUARDIANS CAN ALTER FATE[/b] - Because of the power of our Light, we can the defy the Vex pattern. [quote]Guardians make their own fate. (On-screen text after defeating the oracles in the Vault of Glass raid)[/quote] - The Vex cannot simulate guardians. This [i]might[/i] be related to why we can defy the pattern; our Light makes us beyond any predetermined path. [quote]That you've made breakthrough after breakthrough as to their origins— theories that a Guardian could not be simulated (Osiris)[/quote] - Guardians changing fate might trigger different timelines or not. It's unclear. - Something about this option doesn't seem right to me; we did change fate as experienced/predicted by the Vex, our defiance of fate seems itself like fate. We know the Vex exist in our past, present, and future, so it seems like fate that they aren't erased from time. [b]EDIT:[/b] Not conforming to simulation and not conforming to time are not necessarily related. From the perspective of the Vex, we changed an event that has already happened for them, and not just defied a sim. Oryx defies sims as well, but they still could predict his attack on them. [quote]And Oryx himself, he’s irreducible — he refuses to obey Quria’s simulations. (Verse 5:1 — End Of Failed Timeline)[/quote] [b]Pick which answer you think is correct in the poll. I think B is the most fun philosophically. C seems like the obviously-intended answer, but there are issues. A is certainly plausible. For theories by me, I refer you to the [url=https://www.bungie.net/en/Forum/Post/183288968/0/0]Collected Treatises of The Warlock KAGEHOSHI[/url].[/b]