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Destiny

Discuss all things Destiny.
6/6/2016 1:31:13 AM
342

The Problem with Destiny's Exotics

Exotics should be god-tier, better than other non-exotics

4310

Exotics should be on the same level as non-exotics

263

Down with Exotics, fast fire legendaries 4 lyfe

111

My personal story [spoiler] Recently, I took a very, VERY long hiatus from Destiny to play most of the new games that came out (i.e. Overwatch, Doom) and some old games (i.e. Halo series, Bonerlands, etc). Keep in mind that before I took this break, I'd played Destiny almost every single day for a year and a half. I was playing Doom when I was using the "Double Shotty Combo" (both combat shotgun and super shotgun) and I was top of the leaderboards when I thought, "This shit needs to be nerfed", followed by, "WHAT MANNER OF SISSYNESS IS THIS? Just because something is performing well, it needs to be nerfed?" That little voice in the back of my head said that that's how Destiny manages to keep it's exotics in check. Then it dawned on me, that feeling I hadn't felt in a long time. I was having FUN in Doom, where I hadn't had fun in Crucible since before HoW, before the dark times. At that moment, I realized something.[/spoiler] DESTINY'S FANS HAVE RUINED THE GAME: A History Lesson [spoiler] When Destiny launched back in September 2014, exotics were described as the best of the best, weapons obtained by feats of strength, the hardest activities in the game, etc. Ok, maybe all that didn't pan out, but the part about the best of the best was at least still true. Ice Breaker hit like a truck and had ammo to spare, Invective was the only true fully automatic shotgun, Gjallarhorn was the best boss melter in the game, Red Death could keep you in the fight longer, a Crucible gun with Crucible lore, designed for Crucible, The Last Word had an actual reason to hip-fire, Thorn not only stopped Regen, but also did damage. Then came the Mythoclast, the first gun worth calling a nerf for. The fair few people who actually got the gun, or got paired up realized this gun was broken. People getting 4 shot cross mapped, killed through walls because of Fusion rifle hit-scan, other nerf-worthy incidents. Bungie stomped out a weed before it became a problem, good for them. Then came Suros. A little less nerf-worthy, but certainly a problem. Then all was good, a few patches here and there, but nothing compared to the newest meta; The HoW Meta. Thorn, TLW, and Red Death. The 9 months meta. Thorn was kept in check by a low ammo count with slow reload. The Last Word was kept in check by actually requiring skill to accurately hip-fire. Red Death was always a good choice in Crucible. Then Thorn's ammo count was buffed to 150%, with a reload twice as fast, The Last Word was glitched to not require hip-fire, and Red Death was thrown in as practically the only counter for them. Ever since then, the Forums are constantly plagued by calls for nerfs, buffs, outlandishly ludicrous changes to be made, leading to the destruction of the best weapons in the game.[/spoiler] EXOTICS ARE NOW MOSTLY OBSOLETE [spoiler] Think back to when you got your first exotic. You probably didn't get it fighting the Gas Wyrms of Jupiter, or helping to defend Twilight Gap or the Battle of Six Fronts. You probably got it from something mundane, like as a Strike reward or bottom of the team in Crucible or being a dreaded Xurner. But it didn't matter, it was special to you. "Wow, this weapon shoots poison!" "My gun reloads after every kill!" "This rifle regenerates ammo, that's so cool." It was a magical moment for most all of us, a weapon to be proud of. Now think about someone who just picked up the game recently, someone who is running around with his gunsmith Suros auto rifle rolled with glass half full and focused fire. He places 3rd in the crucible and gets the Suros Regime. "Oh wow, an exotic!" He compares the stats. "My legendary is better in every single way to this crappy exotic." His friend, with equally bad luck, finishes King's Fall and gets Thunderlord. But wait, he rolled a Qullim's Terminus with feeding frenzy. Who needs to waste an exotic slot when you already have a weapon that does the same job, and then some. Now their 3rd friend has ridiculously good luck and gets a god-roll Grasp of Malok on his first run of the Omnigul. When he gets back to the Tower, he decides an engram and gets Bad Juju. "Oh yeah, new exotic!" But the stats on Bad Juju are worse than Grasp of Malok, and he's already got 100% Intellect.[/spoiler] As it stands in the game now, there are very few exotics worth trading a legendary equivalent for. The Last Word has lost any reason to be hip-fired anymore, Suros feels like an overshined legendary gunsmith order, Tlauloc feels like a poor man's Mida Multitool, which is one of the few surviving exotics, almost every heavy machine gun being used is Qullim's Terminus, Thorn shoots tickle darts that do no damage and last about the time it takes to blink, Touch of Malice is literally only used on Oryx and Sisters, I could go on but I think I've made my point. Most of the current Exotics in this game don't really feel 'Exotic' anymore. They just feel like workhorses with a different paint job, and are often times outclassed by other legendaries, or their class it so rigid that there are better options for almost every single activity. (Looking at you Dreg's Promise) Exotics are becoming nothing more than novelty items, things to be flaunted, then switched out or used as a joke. I, for one, can no longer stand the abuse and mistreatment of Exotics any longer, but you can help for just pennies a day. Call 1(800)-555-EXOTIC to cast your vote on whether we should keep exotics on our level, or elevate them to their previous godhood, or just select a choice above.

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  • They should do the same DPS (assuming Bungie knew how to spell "balance") but achieve that in an "exotic" way. You [i]could[/i] have them do higher DPS if you separated PvE and PvP gear, but that's more math and item development than Bungie can handle.

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  • Can someone explain why doctrine is better than Fabian strategy?

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  • Bump

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  • imo its the whole exotic thing that made exotics... well, anything BUT exotic. xur. yes i know, for new players hes awesome but honestly, once a month would have been enough. every week is just overkill. every strike and crucible match has a chance to get every exotic (besides quest and raid stuff). why not let exotics drop at special places? or make every exotic obtainable from a quest? at least that way you kind of have to do something. after a year they finaly made strike exclusives. why didnt they thought of exotics that are strike exclusives? or exclusive to some crucible maps? 3 of coins. yes, everyone uses it now to get exotics to get to 335. no one rly is like "oh, what is the next exotic? maybe i get something that i dont have!" well, maybe some people think that. but why in the love of -blam!- werent exotic boss drops a thing? i mean, this seems like common sense to me. on the e3 they showed us exotic drops from a boss (i know it was just staged to show them off). why didnt this carry over? at least a 0,1% chance should have been in the game from the start... 3 of coins should have never been a thing. (or a very rare drop from nightfall maybe) exotic perks. very, very, very few exotics have a perk thats unique. Suros for example has 2 perks that you can get on any legendary. instead of the "can trigger health regen when killing enemy" perk you get the "when low health has a chance to trigger health regen" perk. giving it arc element would have been an improvement but its still nothig special. same goes to my favorite exotic, red death. it looks nice, does a good amount of dmg and has a good handling. the perk is very useful but since there are already a couple of perks that can trigger health regen... mhmm ok. maybe they should let themself get inspired by halo 5. i dont like the game that much, but the weapon variants have pretty unique abilities. fire 5 tracking rockets, a black hole, tracking bolts, a sniper shoots 3 times, bullets bounce of from walls and track (would be great for hardlight)... maybe some exotics that have special perks purely for pve? (no shank burn) and buff thunderlord and super good advice ._. i rly hope they handle exotics much better in destiny 2. let them feel exotic, better than legendarys. if not for perks, then at least let exotics deal more dmg in pve and keep pve and pvp nerfs seperated.

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  • Yes

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  • Bump

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  • You're right about where they are right now. I see them as intended mostly for PVE in particular situations. Boutique weapons if you will. I think after Gjallarhorn and Thorn's absolute monopolies on this game, it actually makes sense. The exotics cause most of the crucible imbalance..... Get uses to exotic gear being this way...balance etc.

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  • Bump

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  • Bump this shit

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  • There should never be a legendary stronger than any exotic of its own weapon type. Not saying an exotic shotgun should beat a legendary sniper at sniper range, but it should always be better than a legendary shotgun.

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  • Agreed, they just used to feel more powerful and exotic. I agree with what Attackhelicopter said, they should be amazing but have flaws, so you choose what benefits and sacrifices you make. Not just exotics though, I feel insufficiently powerful all around. Skills, weapons, and armour. Some exotics are ok, the super good advice changes made it even more hilarious to use, the swords are great, tlaloc is wonderful. But all the complaining and "balance" changes due to crucible, etc. have screwed things up so much. Destiny is still enjoyable, but not as much fun as it should be.

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  • Edited by Fur Hammerlock: 6/6/2016 11:59:58 AM
    Fabian Strategy is a perfect example. Why it's even an exotic is beyond me, it's barely even Legendary status. I do agree that Exotics should be buffed and/or reworked in certain cases, but Bungie's lead balance team is going to have to find a way to balance PvE and PvP separately. Having Exotics back to Godhood like Thorn, TLW and the like will only create another toxic Crucible environment.

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  • I agree with you completely and have had the same opinion as you ever since year 2 began. The arsenal of weapons in year 1 were much more enjoyable to collect as there were so many exotics I wanted. I miss doing Crotas End, VoG and the nightfall (when it was challenging and forced you back to orbit after death) in hope of getting an exotic I'd literally cut for like Gjallarhorn, Ice Breaker, Suros Regime, Hawkmoon, The Last Word, No Land Beyond, Red Death etc which would make me nearly scream when they drop for me.... Nowadays when I get an exotic I'm like "oh cool I got a zhalo supercell....that's fun I guess.."

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  • The real problem is how easy they are to get and how many there are...we have Xur, 3oC, Raids, PoE and CoE, and did I mention 3oC...3oC made it WAY to easy to get exotics...Remember the first few months of Destiny to the Dark Below? Everyone was striving to get exotics, and once they got one they'd make a forum post rubbing it in people's faces. I want that back again

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  • I noticed this with exotics only recently as black spindle is only one I use as I've just realised I have my eeirine if I decide to use my juju or hawk moon but yeah agree with you

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  • Bungie needs to buff exotics for the same of the starving African children

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  • First of all - most people here seem to be talking exclusively about weapons. Weapons aren't the end all of Destiny and an exotic armour piece can be the defining factor in a playstyle just as much as a weapon. Some of the armour pieces don't suit my playstyle - but then I'll come up against someone using them so well that I am forced to pull them out of the vault and test them again just to see if I missed something. As for the lists of useful exotic weapons that people are reeling off... what the hell? Do you folks really limit yourselves so much when you play? All the exotic heavies are cool now. Yes, even Super Good Advice. As long as you have ammo for them, the perks are insane. T-lord is still the BEST HMG. Super Good Advice is bottomless. Dragons breath is great fun to bounce under bosses. Sleeper is absolutely unique. All the swords are OP as hell in the right place. Gjallarhorn will surprise the hell out of anyone in PvP, Truth is still extremely popular in PvP For Specials - Telesto is hilarious, Plan C is coming back, Invective is super popular. You know what, I'm not going to list them all and sing their praises, and there sure are some that need work or desperately need to come to Y2. But they all FEEL exotic, whether that means odd, funny, beautiful, or powerful. What I'm glad for is that none of them feel MANDATORY.

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    • Lmfao, this moron said a poor mans Mida.... Tlaloc shits on Mida.

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      • I love using my First Curse! Best Hand Cannon in game imo

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      • I'm not sure if this was your point but I feel most exotics don't feel exotic. Exotics should have a special ability not just be OP. Sunsano feels more exotic than most of the exotics. Gally never felt exotic it was just powerful an exotic feeling/perk the only exotics imo are: Dark drinker and Boltcaster swords - because the have an effect not just stabbing like the raze Telesto - the void afterburn Tlaloc - its gets better because of your super NLB, Universal Remote, Vex- because they can be equipped in a slot they're not made for. Red Death - health regen Zen - the dynamite round Ice breaker invective - ammo regen Dragons breath - trail of fire Exotics I'm on the fence about Black Spindle - White nail P&T - camo I don't have NTTE, chaperone, The first curse, jade rabbit or necro so I can't judge those.

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        • Sadly a lot of this is true. I use exotics less and less now, even in PVE.

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          • Exotics should fall into one of two categories: 1. Legendary style weapons with exotic perks that given them an edge e.g. Red Death, Invective, Super Good Advice, Ice Breaker, P&T 2. Weapons that do things no other weapons can e.g. Vex Mythoclast, Gjallarhorn, Pocket Infinity, Thorn. The problem with weapons right now is three-fold: Uninspiring exotics for the most part in year 2. As much as I want to like weapons like NTTE or Gemini they just don't wow me. Then there is the frequent sandbox nerfs which only satisfy the ultra-sweaty types. And finally something that has never changed in Destiny is shitty boss design in PVE. I find it amazing that nearly 2 years in every boss promotes ranges encounters and the latest raid encourages you to go with two exotivs (Spindle and Malice).

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            • Boolean gemini :> Why are the "exotic" perks the way they are? So useless imo. Not a bad gun but i can easily replace it with a suros scout from gunsmith...i mean come on exotic? Really?

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              • Edited by C-Sentinel: 6/6/2016 5:34:58 AM
                I feel like most exotics should serve at least one of 3 purposes. One as being a unique weapon. Weapons like QBB and Lord of Wolves, or NLB. Secondly being build-based. Bad Juju can be used of super chaining builds, Monte Carlo for a melee build, etc. Third is being a niche weapon. Having a unique perk that allows it to out perform everything else in situations. Ghorn and Icebreaker being examples. Every exotic should serve one of these 3 principles, or there is no reason to be exoitc. Red Death is just a pusle with feeding frenzy and life support. Thunderlord performs like an average MG most of the time.

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                • I have a legendary machine gun that is far superior to any exotic machine gun I've used and I've been playing this shit since day 1. Check my warlock.

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                  • Edited by Snake: 6/6/2016 9:01:32 AM
                    i always thought that exotics should be set to a maximum of maybe 360 when compared to the legendary maximum of 335 giving exotics that little bit extra power when campared to a legendary class. yes they should still have that perk list that makes them original creations but certain parts should also be random so one exotic of the same type could be better or worse than your current one (if you already have it) if just to make it none build/situation specific like most exotics seem to be now.

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