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originally posted in: Final Shape Collector's Edition
3/19/2024 12:58:52 AM
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Honestly it was a great first time read and there’s a few points that stood out to me in reading it. [spoiler]We get confirmation that so far as the Precursors were concerned, they were the first to be chosen by the Gardener.[/spoiler] [spoiler]We see that the Gardener gifts were wielded by factions of the Precursors for malicious purposes. It seems that like their questioning of the Gardeners lack of direction regarding their purpose, it’s lack of intervention regarding these rogue elements also played a part in their eventual betrayal.[/spoiler] [spoiler]We see that the Precursors seeded worlds with life using gifts from the Gardener. Now, this isn’t to say these Precursors created Humanity. In fact, that’s impossible. The statues on the Dreadnought predate the formation of the Earth, so Humanity seemingly sprouted up naturally.[/spoiler] [spoiler]How the Witness treats civilisations not blessed by the Traveler. Now THIS is absolutely fascinating, because this is another outlier in regards to the Witnesses methods. We see that in the absence of the Traveler the Witness is more efficient in its annihilation of a species. It doesn’t attempt to bend them to its will, it doesn’t recruit a Disciple, it simply dissects them and moves on. Because the Witness wasn’t a perfect creation of the Precursors. Because how else do we explain this cruelty? It believes wholly in its purpose, this Final Shape, yet still the rages at the Gardener remains. It seeks to either make those touched by the Traveler suffer or seeks to corrupt them. Look at Rhulk, the First Disciple. Lubrae was visited by the Traveler long ago, having departed long before Rhulk’s time. Yet the Witness waits ever so patiently until Rhulk comes along, turning him into its instrument of destruction and rendering all of Lubrae to dust and echoes. Why this distinction? It’s not purely directed towards the Traveler, because even in its absence the display continues. Is it perhaps angry that we cannot see what it sees? Whatever the case, we see that the rage Mara described in the Witness is against more than simply existence itself, because if it was then why offer the Noesis some comfort?[/spoiler] [spoiler]The Nihilists as described within the Precursor records almost sounds like Sword Logic rhetoric to me, that destruction was deserved and the natural way of things. If the Witness did write Unveiling, is this portrayal perhaps born of this opposing ideology? Is that where the deceptive portrayal of the Final Shape as given to the Osmium Siblings came from? Is this another lingering remnant of the Precursors within the Witness?[/spoiler] There’s probably more, but I can’t wait to see this book dissected more thoroughly. Even if it feels like we should have gotten some of these answers during this year, especially with Lightfall.
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  • Sounds very interesting. Looking forward to learning more in 77 days!

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  • [spoiler]The Nihilists aren't quite Sword Logic rhetoric. I just recalled a line from the Unveiling where the speaker describes nihilists as beings who deserve no thought. More specifically: [url=https://www.ishtar-collective.net/entries/the-cambrian-explosion]Those who peddle the tired gotcha that all life hastens entropy. They are fatuous little nihilists who pretend to prefer no existence to a flawed one. They bore me.[/url] Saying nihilists bore you takes on new meaning when it turns out your constituent minds destroyed a group that called themselves the [Nihilists | Redolent |Accepting]. The Sword Logic might lean closer to a form of Solipsism - only your own existence is certain, and you prove your existence through the act of killing. But I can see where the Nihilistic influence might come in, by describing things that die did not deserve to exist, that it was their "final shape". But the core of the final shape, at least what RS and the Penitent believed it to be, is "improvement". In Sword Logic terms, that would be "becoming sharp". A Hive "improves" themselves through the act of killing, by honing themselves through combat. Oryx "improved" himself through navigation and understanding. Savathun "improved" herself through successful acts of deception and cunning. Xivu Arath "improved" herself through the simple act of war and fighting. A possible alternative to why the Witness is so angry might be due to why Calus' words struck such a nerve, and even why it has such burning hatred of the Light and its "chaos". As I once brought up, and Entelechy all but confirms, the Final Shape is all the Witness can think of to do with the universe because it literally cannot do anything else. It is incapable of deviating from the purpose it was made for, and perhaps incapable of losing the rage the Precursors felt toward the Traveler. It could even be aware of this fact, [url=https://www.ishtar-collective.net/entries/the-first-knife]but it is incapable of being anything other than what it was made to be[/url]. [/spoiler]

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  • That’s what Bungie meant about Unveiling being about complex concepts we don’t understand. Darkness isn’t just Consciousness and Winnowing. It’s also part of the cosmic laws regarding evolution. Look at the key phrases and words. - To cut away what doesn’t work and keep what does. What exists does so because it proves it’s right to exist Darwinism “Improvement” Slicing but not connecting. - One aspect of Nature slices away (kill/prune/winnow) and another aspect fills in the gap (creation/evolution/gardening) Too many people thought Darkness was only about Winnowing and the Sword Logic was only about reduction or simplifying. When it’s actually a complex and mutli-faceted aspect of cosmic evolution and likely other aspects of cosmic function. Which was said in Unveiling and as far back as D1 Darkness cards. https://www.ishtar-collective.net/cards/ghost-fragment-darkness-3#ghost-fragments

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