Is the Black Garden an isolated pocket dimension simulated by the Vex, or something else? I'm guessing it's not "the" Garden, like winnower and gardener, since they seem to be incorporeal, and so does "The Garden".
Next, why are the Vex so interested in the Black Garden, and does the "Black" part signify that it was created through Darkness, or meant to be a Darkness version of something else?
Following that, why did the Vex create the Black Heart inside the Garden, specifically, and not somewhere else?
At the end of "The Black Garden" campaign mission, we destroy the Black Heart, and Ghost mentions "we're back on Mars"; I assumed the Garden could only be entered through trans-dimensional access points (like in the Tenebrous Tunnels mission), and wasn't actually attached to a physical space (similar to the Vex Net or Ascendant Plane), so was this a continuity error, maybe a retconned concept?
Now for the Vex, why is their only goal to "make everything Vex"? Did they learn this "final shape" dogma from the Hive or Witness maybe, was it always their goal? And why?
Why do the Vex never interact with Earth [when they are prevalent nearly everyplace else], exept for the friendly Harpy, and the time they were essentially welcomed in by Lakshmi?
The Vex continue to reside in Sol, and continue to initiate conflict: why don't they leave, and why don't they deploy heavy combat units if they insist on staying? They seem to be entirely incapable of defeating The Guardian and won't accomplish most of their goals because of them.
Next up, why haven't the Vex tried to construct an Agioktis type unit to trap The Guardian and drain their power? I believe it was mentioned that it took centuries to construct, but can't the Vex just pull the design of this unit from somewhere and repurpose it, or replicate its ability to drain Light?
What is the most heavily Vex infested planet in Sol that we know of? Why do they chose to focus some planets and moons more than others, and why do they need to enact "Convergence"?
Finally, why aren't the Vex taking advantage of Darkness? They could incorporate Stasis and Strand into their weaponry, but they don't seem to want to, or maybe aren't able?
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Edited by MC 077 Lasombra: 5/24/2025 11:51:15 PMNo, the Black Garden is/was a location on Mars the Vex converted and transported. As it was, in the base storyline, the location where they found an artifact of Darkness post Collapse. They learned their dogma from their time in the flower game. The only way to ensure existence was to make the entire pattern of flowers vex. So now everything in the cosmos must be Vex. But yes, they seem rather timid. Very early promo material for the d1 game said the Traveler was shielding the Last City from the darkness. That’s why the Hive and Vex didn’t invade the City. This was cut but the game was made, so canonically no reason. That unit was tailored specifically to Saint’s Light frequency with other dialogue suggesting they couldn’t make one anyway due to what is implied to be a limited resource. Mercury was completely converted. Nessus is likely second with Venus and Europa following up. Neomuna is hard to say. Given how they predict and work off of them? I’d say they need everyone fighting to give them openings to take advantage of, like they did in Curse probably it’s assumed because it’s never revealed what plan they actually had where they won. -edit Bungie could just be waiting to implement it for when the conductor and the independent vex reappear. There are inconsistencies and logic gaps when it comes to the Vex still despite all this time and retconning.
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Edited by MNN8TV: 5/23/2025 9:00:06 PMI’m oversimplifying this because it would take forever so don’t crucify me other lore people. 1.) Yes the black garden is likely the very same garden that the flower game took place in. Byf has a good video on it somewhere if you want the evidence behind it. I don’t believe it has been explicitly confirmed however. 2.) The vex are what won the flower game every, single, time. The gardener hated that the flower game because it essentially had no room for anything unique. Because the vex won, every, single, time. That is also why they are the only intelligent species in the garden currently. Because that is the playing field they have won in since time immemorial. 3.) The gardener changed the rules by adding itself to the game alongside the winnower. That added paracausality (actions that break the standard rules of the universe) has prevented the vex from winning like they always have before. However their sole goal continues to be the last living species in the universe. 4.) The vex struggle with paracausality because it can’t be predicted very well. They have won the flower game every time because alongside being a perfect unfeeling hive mind, their predictions were always correct. If you understand how the word works perfectly then even the future can be simulated exactly. Now they can’t do that, they try, and it works sometimes. But paracausal beings like guardians, and oryx give them particular trouble because they don’t follow the same rules everything else does. 5.) The vex have successfully worked with light and darkness to a very limited degree. The black heart was an “artificial” attempt at creating another veil like the one on neomuna. It worked but only partially, it created a connection with the traveler, but only substantially weakened the traveler instead of being capable of doing things like the witness did with the veil. They can also sorta understand the light. It took them absolute ages to do it, but they created a vex specifically tuned to saint 14s light which allowed them to kill him in the infinite forest. They haven’t done that with other guardians because they need a captive subject and an absolutely crazy amount of time to pull it off. In theory they could do it again but it would require a captive subject to study exactly how their light works. Which again, dosent make much sense to the vex so it takes them a long time. Bonus personal theory: The vex haven’t used heavy combat units because they don’t know how to win yet. Why would you start a fight you don’t know how to win? So they continue to do what they know best. To try and turn all the organic matter they can find into vex tech to be used for various purposes.
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[quote]Is the Black Garden an isolated pocket dimension simulated by the Vex, or something else? I'm guessing it's not "the" Garden, like winnower and gardener, since they seem to be incorporeal, and so does "The Garden".[/quote] ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ -Bungie [quote]Next, why are the Vex so interested in the Black Garden[/quote] Based off Unveiling its their home [quote]does the "Black" part signify that it was created through Darkness, or meant to be a Darkness version of something else? [/quote] ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ -Bungie [quote]Following that, why did the Vex create the Black Heart inside the Garden, specifically, and not somewhere else?[/quote] ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ -Bungie [quote]At the end of "The Black Garden" campaign mission, we destroy the Black Heart, and Ghost mentions "we're back on Mars"; I assumed the Garden could only be entered through trans-dimensional access points (like in the Tenebrous Tunnels mission), and wasn't actually attached to a physical space (similar to the Vex Net or Ascendant Plane), so was this a continuity error, maybe a retconned concept?[/quote] ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ -Bungie [quote]Now for the Vex, why is their only goal to "make everything Vex"? Did they learn this "final shape" dogma from the Hive or Witness maybe, was it always their goal? And why?[/quote] The latter. Its theyre only purpose [quote]Why do the Vex never interact with Earth [when they are prevalent nearly everyplace else], exept for the friendly Harpy, and the time they were essentially welcomed in by Lakshmi?[/quote] ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ -Bungie [quote]The Vex continue to reside in Sol, and continue to initiate conflict[/quote] "Initiate" [quote]why don't they deploy heavy combat units if they insist on staying? They seem to be entirely incapable of defeating The Guardian and won't accomplish most of their goals because of them.[/quote] ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ -Bungie [quote]Next up, why haven't the Vex tried to construct an Agioktis type unit to trap The Guardian and drain their power? I believe it was mentioned that it took centuries to construct, but can't the Vex just pull the design of this unit from somewhere and repurpose it, or replicate its ability to drain Light?[/quote] ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ -Bungie [quote]What is the most heavily Vex infested planet in Sol that we know of?[/quote] Mercury [quote]Why do they chose to focus some planets and moons more than others[/quote] ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ -Bungie [quote]Finally, why aren't the Vex taking advantage of Darkness? They could incorporate Stasis and Strand into their weaponry, but they don't seem to want to, or maybe aren't able?[/quote] Making content is hard -Bungie
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Edited by damascus: 5/24/2025 12:43:37 AM