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originally posted in:Halo Archive
Edited by Lord of Admirals:
7/6/2014 3:33:17 AM
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They still use them in Halo 2A. They just slapped Halo 2 Elite armor on them.
English
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Edited by Vien 'Quitonm: 7/6/2014 3:54:00 AMYeaaaah.
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I'm on mobile. Are you saying I'm wrong? Wouldn't be surprised. I just thought they were keeping the models consistent across campaign and multiplayer.
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Edited by Vien 'Quitonm: 7/6/2014 4:03:55 AMModifications and combinations, depending on the case. He also said there's no one answer to the models.
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Grunts are obviously Halo Reach though. =/ Hope that changes.
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Noo why?
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Edited by Lord of Admirals: 7/6/2014 6:26:43 AMPrepare for a rant: It sort of pisses me off how everyone got really upset over the change of appearance in the Halo 4 grunts. It seems like everyone fails to miss how in Halo CE and Halo 2, the Grunts had tough alligator skin (somewhat comparable to Halo 4 actually), and then all of the sudden in Halo 3: Bam. Exoskeleton. And everyone just ate that up and was okay with it. I actually confirmed this change with one of Bungie's old developers who worked on Halo CE - Halo 3. Basically, they've been doing a great job staying true to the original models, and the remastered grunt model just sticks out to me as not being true to the original design.
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Edited by j0sh291: 7/6/2014 6:35:28 AMI understand you but that change was not that drastic as what 343 did for Halo 4... Exoskeletons or not, they change too much in Halo 4. You can't change something that has been for 10 years in games and boom have something totally different! The change that Bungie made was significant and maybe people who are very into details (like you) noticed it and didnt like it. Yet it seemed similiar to what the studio made in first place.
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Edited by Lord of Admirals: 7/6/2014 6:36:04 AMGrunts having an exoskeleton was introduced in Halo 3. It had yet to be in any lore prior. Also, that change was not that drastic? Tough skin -> Exoskeleton = No complaints from us! Exoskeleton -> Tough skin = NOOOOOOOOOOOOSNfljsangjbrglijstdkhn
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Well, to be fair. It went from Exoskeleton to horrifying amalgamation of a mammal, a reptile, and something with tough skin that resembles a Wretch from GoW. The general shape remained about the same from Halo 2 to 3 as well.
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The change that Bungie made was significant and maybe people who are very into details (like you) noticed it and didnt like it. Yet it seemed similiar to what the studio made in first place. So why change the whole thing...maybe 343 could've done what Bungie did with their skin in a very suitable way.
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Edited by Lord of Admirals: 7/6/2014 6:41:03 AMIt's not that I don't like it, it's that the community is hypocritical over the whole situation. The only thing similar is the skin color. Hell, grunts were supposed to have snouts originally... Why change the whole thing? Because maybe grunts were never supposed to have exoskeletons? Maybe 343i attempted to alienize the Covenant?
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I agree that those kinds of details should've be done correctly. But what I don't like is the change from 10 years to suddenly be different... And Upgrade or a remake would've been enough. I like change, but changes may be for good or bad. And in my opinion this was a bad change without any warning. Suitable changes as I said would've work better.
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The Halo 3 change was without warning as well. There's nothing you can really say to diffientriate these changes from each other.
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Yes, but in a suitable way. Why complain about their skin? If Bungie back in 2007 would've changed the grunt, similar or like Halo 4's. I know everyone would complain about it. 343 introduced "a new" grunt, in 4 years a grunt cannot mutate or change their appeareance. Suitble changes would be better, than changing everything up.
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How is that a suitable change? It's tough skin to a -blam!-ing exoskeleton. Then for Halo 4, it's the exoskeleton back to tough skin. So what difference makes it suitable for Halo 3 but not Halo 4? Is it because it was Bungie?
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I liked the halo 4 grunts
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Edited by Fallen Hero: 7/6/2014 1:45:14 PMI think he means the armor they wear on top of their skin. Looking at Vien's comparison pic the faces seem a lot different (wider) too. I preferred the mouth covered.
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They did not change the whole grunt model for a game like 343 did. Also you can't be pleased if their skin was different in a game from another. Unless you were scoping the grunts as soon as you started playing H3 and getting mad about that "huge" change. There is maybe a huge gap between grunt models from Halo 1,2,3 even Reach in comparison to Halo 4's. Heck there's even a pic in this thread showing that. Halo 4's grunts are supposedly to look like they were described in first place, but books and games are different. Like Movies and Books, you can't have every detail that the book offers into a digital movie and in this case a game.
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[quote]They did not change the whole grunt model for a game like 343 did.[/quote]Yes they did. Every single grunt in every Halo game has always had the exact same body proportions. What's changed is their model. And for Halo 2 to Halo 3, [url=https://twitter.com/Dr_Abominable/status/466228635318243328]it makes no sense at all.[/url] [quote]Also you can't be pleased if their skin was different in a game from another.[/quote]Why? Is the entirety of the Unggoy species not allowed pigment variation? [quote]Unless you were scoping the grunts as soon as you started playing H3 and getting mad about that "huge" change.[/quote]I have to repeat myself again? Alright then... The change does not upset me. What upsets me is the community's reaction to the change. [quote]There is maybe a huge gap between grunt models from Halo 1,2,3 even Reach in comparison to Halo 4's. [/quote] Halo CE - Blue Tough Skin Halo 2 - Brownish/blackish Tough skin Halo 3 - black exoskeleton Halo: Reach - black exoskeleton Halo Wars - Pale Grey tough skin Halo Legends - bluish tough skin Halo 4 - pale grey tough skin If you really want to be technical, Halo 3 and Reach are the odd ones out in terms of grunt design. [quote]Halo 4's grunts are supposedly to look like they were described in first place[/quote]Did you even read the novels? The Grunts were supposed to be blue alien space dogs with snouts and tough skin. Note: That description has obviously been retconned [quote]but books and games are different. Like Movies and Books, you can't have every detail that the book offers into a digital movie and in this case a game.[/quote]Not a very good analogy. The Halo games aren't adaptions of any of the novels. Nor do they have separate continuums. All exist on the same timeline and all are canon.
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Im not saying Halo was based on books, books came after the games. But the books described them in more detail as well the Studios. --- I agree that Halo 3 and Reach grunts differ more, but yet again, not very different to the H4 Grunts model.
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Edited by Lord of Admirals: 7/6/2014 10:16:54 PMActually the first piece of Halo content available to the public was Halo: The Fall of Reach. [quote]I agree that Halo 3 and Reach grunts differ more, but yet again, not very different to the H4 Grunts model.[/quote]The thing that changed with the Halo 4 grunts was higher graphical fidelity and light grey skin. Halo 3 and Reach have the odd ones out and it ticks me off the community is so hypocritical about the changes.
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Your source on the novel being first than the game? Yeah I understand and even might hate me, but I don't like what 343 did for the Covenant look, even if it similiar to what the Studio and books description on how it looked. Changing a thing we've seen after 10 years is not really a good idea.
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[quote]Your source on the novel being first than the game?[/quote] [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halo:_The_Fall_of_Reach]October 30th, 2001[/url] [quote]even might hate me[/quote]Why would I hate you? [quote]Changing a thing we've seen after 10 years is not really a good idea.[/quote]Except that statement is flawed in itself as the designs of the Covenant have never been consistent. They've changed a handful of times throughout the years. [quote]even if it similiar to what the Studio and books description on how it looked.[/quote]What is this "Studio" you keep referring to? Also, why do you keep bringing up the novels? I've never once cited them to justify their appearance. Even if I did, the point is moot because the Covenant are aliens and have variations in their genes that are possibly unprecedented on Earth. As far as I'm concerned, each visual representation of the Covenant are canon (343i has actually advocated this, and stated that fans shouldn't worry because Halo's universe is large and diverse enough to accommodate the visual changes across an item.). Minus the gaps in graphical fidelity of course.
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The novel was released 1 month before, the game was made 2 years before the novel was made. The game clearly came in first. (Thats anothee topic) Anyways I dislike on how the grunt looks on Halo 4, yet again Bungie did some changes but they were graphical and not huge to what 343 did. Studios: Bungie and 343i.
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[quote]The novel was released 1 month before, the game was made 2 years before the novel was made. The game clearly came in first. (Thats anothee topic)[/quote]Go back and read what I wrote. I'm not daft. [quote]Anyways I dislike on how the grunt looks on Halo 4, yet again Bungie did some changes but they were graphical and not huge to what 343 did.[/quote]What? The only changes to the Halo 4 grunts were graphical as well. The silhouette is the same, the proportions are the same, hell, the Halo 4 grunts run on Reach's grunt algorithms.
