I will place one of my links directly after a paragraph where I think it is better suited, but the rest will be annotated at the bottom of my post. [quote]1. We need animal protein[/quote]We need protein. There is nothing magical about animal protein that cannot be obtained elsewhere. [quote]creatine[/quote]Produced endogenously, and most forms of monohydrate are synthetic (vegan). [quote]carnosine[/quote]Also produced endogenously. I'm assuming you got these from the same site that was linked by another user. Regardless, carnosine production can be increased by taking beta-alanine (vegan) (i). [quote]and DHAs.[/quote]There are plenty of vegan DHA supplements available. (ii) [quote]2. There are no studies, whatsoever, that prove being vegan is a better choice. Ever.[/quote]Well, there are, just as there are studies in the opposite direction -- such as certain atkins studies, which I'll get to in a sec. Many of these studies lack sufficient peer-reviewing and the controlled conditions are difficult to map onto conclusive findings rather than simply suggestive ones. As of yet, the only concrete conclusion that matters is that both vegan and meat based diets can achieve optimal health, [b]if[/b] structured properly (this is important for both). [quote]3. The Atkins diet, a low carb high fat meat eating diet, crushed veganism in a study on multiple human subjects. Atkins participants were healthier and better off.[/quote]Citation needed. I am assuming that you are referring to the A to Z study, which is questionable on a couple of fronts. 1. There was no mention of supplementation 2. The ornish (pseudo-vegan) diet contained animal products, likely due to a lack of (1) and 3. The results showed no health regresses in a moderate to high carb diet, simply less progress than a low carb one. The good news regardless is that the Atkins diet is doable with vegan foods, and with the same positive results (iii and iv). [quote]4. Vegans use scare tactics to get more people and lie to get their way becuase they have no valid evidence.[/quote]There are no doubt uneducated vegans just as there are uneducated people in every field. However, there is plenty of evidence in favour of going vegan, and not all of it is health related. [quote]Animals are not people and dpn't deserve our same rights.[/quote]Of course not. Nobody is saying cows should be allowed to vote and run for public office -- they don't have the capacities to do so. However, do they have a capacity to feel pain and suffer? Yes. Do they have an interest in not being killed? Yes. Any "rights" a person has is dependent on their capacity to exercise them. Otherwise it would be a meaningless word blowing in the wind. Animals have rights as far as such capacities extend. [quote]Anima cruelty is unacceptable, but no United States governed slaughter house does nay of the thing PETA says they do.[/quote]This is false. There's a good documentary -- not affiliated with PETA -- on youtube that shows inside footage from America's leading factory farms. Worth a watch, if you can stomach it. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ibuQ-J04eLQ&app=desktop&persist_app=1&client=mv-google&hl=en-GB&gl=AU Interestingly (although not surprisingly) there are people who see footage like this and still refuse to accept that it represents the majority of factory farms. When I ask them to present evidence backing their belief, however, they are unable to. They have become so conditioned to seeing cows in grassy meadows on milk cartons and McDonald's adverts that, when presented with a far more inconvenient truth, they shrug it off as "the exception". This is clearly a case of confirmation bias. Ask yourself: which evidence is more valid -- footage by the media with their hands in the farming industry's pockets, or footage captured (often illegally) by small nonprofit groups with no clear agenda other than exposing the truth? [quote]There is no point in slaughtering male chicks, there's no meat! They are used in other ways; that would not be cost effective and GMO grown heavy foul are better utilsed.[/quote]No, because the chicks in the egg industry are selectively bred in a different strain than meat chickens. Egg chickens do not grow large breast and leg muscles and the males are therefore useless for meat. (v) [quote]6.The China Study was total bullshit.[/quote]Agreed. [quote]8. Vegan diets CAN work short term, but only in short term ill people.[/quote]How do you figure this? What exactly is detrimental in the long term? Keep in mind that all essential nutrients can be obtained from non-animal sources before you answer. [quote]11. Veganism would ruin our economy, and if veganism had any real ground, we'd figure it out. But it doesn't.[/quote]Except the world wouldn't turn vegan overnight. If it were to happen, it would happen gradually, and the economy would shift with it. Also be aware of corporate incentive -- having a monopoly of the meat industry is a good move when most of the population eats it. Having a monopoly of agriculture is a good move when most of the population is vegan. Economic collapses usually happen due to unforeseen circumstances. It should also be noted that as far as a global economy, the animal industries are doing damage -- wasting massive amounts of food (vi and vii) that could be outsourced to developing countries and establish an intercontinental market. There are obviously moral implications here as well as economic (although the two need not be separated). [quote]12. Humans are meant to eat meat.[/quote]We evolved the ability to digest it. This is a very different (and less misleading) statement than saying we are "meant" to eat it. In fact, in order to claim we are [i]meant[/i] to do something you require a moral imperative. Otherwise, there's no obligation one way or the other. i: http://www.veganhealth.org/articles/carnosine ii: http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B005R5CARY?pc_redir=1412269268&robot_redir=1 iii: http://archinte.jamanetwork.com/Mobile/article.aspx?articleid=415074 iv: http://www.atkins.com/Program/Overview/Ways-to-Customize-Atkins,-Your-Diet-Plan/Atkins-for-Vegans.aspx v: http://kb.rspca.org.au/What-happens-with-male-chicks-in-the-egg-industry_100.html vi: http://www.fao.org/docrep/010/a0701e/a0701e00.htm vii: http://www.epa.gov/agriculture/ag101/cropmajor.html